psycho_driver@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 13:53
nextcollapse
Gotta fund the war machine somehow.
Zoldyck@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 13:58
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Sick fucks
Ragdoll_X@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 14:00
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The Haruspex is at it again!
FlyingSquid@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 14:33
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Tankies: “Russia is simply looking out for its sickest. Do you want them to die, you monster?!”
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works
on 25 Jul 2024 14:49
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I mean… yes, if the price is harvesting organs from POWs. Not really even a controversial answer.
FlyingSquid@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 15:00
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I see you haven’t talked to too many Tankies.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works
on 25 Jul 2024 15:57
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Oh, believe me, I have, and it’s great fun to troll them.
peopleproblems@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 15:01
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You know what, I’m pretty sure we’re going to hear some bullshit about “eastern worldview vs western world view” when it’s really just violent nationalism.
girlfreddy@lemmy.ca
on 25 Jul 2024 15:25
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The act of removing organs from POWs violates the Geneva Conventions, which protect the dignity and rights of prisoners of war. Such actions, if confirmed, could be subject to international prosecution and sanctions.
‘If confirmed’? I’d think the body being returned without internal organs would be confirmation enough.
What other excuse could Putin use? That rats got to the body and only ate the heart, liver and kidneys?
Jumuta@sh.itjust.works
on 25 Jul 2024 16:03
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conventions are only suggestions if you’ve got nothing to lose
echodot@feddit.uk
on 26 Jul 2024 09:48
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Ooh Russia has done it now.
Railcar8095@lemm.ee
on 26 Jul 2024 12:27
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Would this be the first Geneva violation? Or this is consisted worse than pillaging and raping?
nilloc@discuss.tchncs.de
on 26 Jul 2024 17:29
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Or kidnapping, or, you know, invading a sovereign nation.
In all fairness, Geneva doesn’t forbid war, just tries to set some humane rules.
That sentence broke my brain.
BruceTwarzen@lemm.ee
on 26 Jul 2024 14:03
nextcollapse
The point is that it’s not really confirmed. It’s like if putin says that they returned pow’s with boots up their asses, you wouldn’t just assume it’s true. I’m not saying it’s not true, but it also seems like a lot of work just to be a dickhead. I would assume they didn’t remove the organs in a way that they could be put to use again.
I would assume they wouldn’t go through the trouble of removing organs without a good reason, ie: to transplant into some rich Russian.
explodicle@sh.itjust.works
on 26 Jul 2024 16:45
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Does it still count if they remove the organs after the prisoner is already dead?
homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 16:10
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Friendly reminder the republiQans back russia.
Well, many do. Perjury Traitor Greed, Beavis, probably the Vaping Handjobber
andrew_bidlaw@sh.itjust.works
on 25 Jul 2024 16:25
nextcollapse
I’d wait until it’s reported by bigger media channels with their reputation at the stake. Not only it’s stupid, easily provable, heinous, inhumane, but it’s also hard to carry it out, en masse and for no reason, with transplants being executed by select few clinics and less than a thousand of doctors. And having read a lot about prisons and army in USSR and modern Russia, I’ve seen a lot of morbid shit done to a living being, but yet to hear something about organized organ extraction from the dead. It also dawns on me that with how underfed and beaten POWs come back to Ukraine, there should’ve been a different camp to secure their health for their organs to be worth an operation.
Right now I mark it red but am open to rewiev that.
Badeendje@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 17:36
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Who said anything about harvesting from the dead.
andrew_bidlaw@sh.itjust.works
on 25 Jul 2024 18:12
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I’d assume dead once they are on the table knowing our sad state of medicine.
ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de
on 25 Jul 2024 19:25
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You seem to think they’re letting pows die and extracting organs later? Not much point in that.
andrew_bidlaw@sh.itjust.works
on 25 Jul 2024 20:14
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You are the second person to point that out. That’s on me. No, I don’t think they choose dead or dying for transplants because, yes, the conditions leading to death and degenerative processes starting right after that render organs useless.
Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 16:56
nextcollapse
Sounds like Russians are harvesting live organs from living POW’s, then sending the victims’ remains back as a “fuck you” to the families.
Since Russia ignores the Geneva Convention, they should be excluded from it. Ukraine ahould be permitted to exterminate cockroaches inside of Russia.
sandbox@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 18:03
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the Geneva Conventions mostly exist to protect innocent people from war, they should never be ignored, no matter what.
Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 06:34
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The targets need not be civilian.
FlyingSquid@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 19:24
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“They’re committing war crimes, so we’re committing war crimes” is a bad strategy that only leads to escalation.
s19oj1aj2t@lemmy.cafe
on 25 Jul 2024 20:21
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Ok human fart
Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 06:30
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The Russians are violating an agreement. When a party leaves an agreement, there is no longer an agreement. It is impractical for one party to abide by this specific agreement when that party suffers death as a result.
FlyingSquid@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 10:47
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No, that is not an excuse to do things like use poison gas, biological weapons or child soldiers. All that does is make things worse. It eventually leads to a nuclear weapon. I’m not sure why you don’t see where escalation leads.
Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 15:43
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I have not suggested any of those actions at all. Also, we are in disagreement about the threat of Putin’s ancient nuclear armament which has been maintained by notorious black-market scalpers for the past 50+ years.
FlyingSquid@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 15:48
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You have not. You have suggested that war crimes are acceptable. All of those things are war crimes. Escalation to making war crimes acceptable make those things acceptable.
And it’s nice of you to be willing to sacrifice Kyiv because you don’t think any of Putin’s nukes work. I imagine Zelensky (and most of the rest of the Ukrainian population) don’t feel like that’s a risk that’s worth taking.
Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 16:21
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That’s a risk they are taking by fighting Putin at all. He’s drawn numerous lines in the sand using the threat of nuking Kyiv, all (or most) of which have been crossed. That’s why he’s escalated to threatening Europe and the West. Even he is not confident in his arsenal.
I concede that it is more wise to not push to the point of finding out if possible, but I do not believe bending to or negotiating with Putin would be useful in making Ukraine whole again. I also don’t think maintaining our current milquetoast approach to defending Ukraine is going to be effective either. I’m mostly in agreement with your positions, I’m just not in absolute agreement. I think a dramatic and swift action against Putin himself (a probable violation of Hague Conventions) would be an effective approach to ending the invasion.
I will hold my tongue on some other violations of international rules because they are vicious and I would (like most people) prefer we avoid them if possible. But, I think it would be an error to remove all such options dogmatically. I think Putin (and Russia at large) should be put on notice that when they refuse to play by the rules, the rules may be suspended in actions against them.
FlyingSquid@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 16:23
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There is a massive gulf between not bending or negotiating and committing war crimes.
The allies were able to fight the Nazis without becoming the Nazis.
Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 16:29
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The allies were able to fight the Nazis without becoming the Nazis.
Agreed. I think that level of aggression is needed to solve this issue as well. We aren’t doing that, though. We are supporting Kyiv just enough to survive while the enemy ignores rule after rule against them.
FlyingSquid@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 16:31
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Okay, but that’s a different subject. This started with the suggestion that if Russia is committing war crimes, Ukraine should as well.
Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 16:40
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It should be made clear to Russia that when they ignore the rules, they are removing the rules that protect them as well. I do not mean to suggest a blanket free-for-all of atrocities, but rather the crossing of some useful lines that we wouldn’t normally cross.
But you can rest assured no one is going to do anything because our leadership seems fine with Ukraine being slowly bled to death. Assassinations, explosive aggression and a bit of “unfair” behavior should be on the table to bring an end to this. Unfortunately, an end doesn’t seem to be our goal, as we are allowing this to last for years.
FlyingSquid@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 16:41
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I do not mean to suggest a blanket free-for-all of atrocities, but rather the crossing of some useful lines that we wouldn’t normally cross.
And I’m telling you, that leads to escalation. Russia will then do something worse. Should Ukraine do something worse to then in return? At what point does it stop?
Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 16:48
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Your point is valid. I disagree that such action should be avoided. Holding our current pattern will result in continued death of the innocent.
I believe a much more aggressive posture is needed to win. That posture should include threats that surprise and instill fear and should be followed with swift action (which does not necessarily include atrocities).
s19oj1aj2t@lemmy.cafe
on 25 Jul 2024 20:20
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LMAO probably fake news but still funny
SkyezOpen@lemmy.world
on 25 Jul 2024 20:30
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Trolls really have gotten worse lately, huh.
febra@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 07:33
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Straight out of the Israel playbook
Andromxda@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 26 Jul 2024 10:23
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Straight out of the Nazi playbook
Deceptichum@quokk.au
on 26 Jul 2024 12:17
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Why’d you copy their comment?
Andromxda@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 26 Jul 2024 14:42
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Sorry, won’t do that again
michaelmrose@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 16:21
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In regards to the Palestinians/Israelis this appears to be a malicious lie. If you look into it you see weird claims like poisoning people to take their organs (this ruins the organs) and taking people from graveyards for the recently killed (you don’t bury people and then come back for their shit) .
The allegations being a mix of unlikely claims and provable lies suggests there is no merit whatsoever to such claims.
This is awful. This is what happens when international laws are selectively enforced.
For the sake of innocent Ukrainians and innocents everywhere, someone needs to start enforcing the laws on everyone.
Freefall@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 15:00
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My unfounded conspiracy theory is that it is to hide certain torture and poisoning techniques. I have no knowledge on the subject, but it seems like a practical yet poorly thought out thing the orcs would do. Remove stomach and kidneys to hide stuff…then remove other things to obfuscate.
Also selling organs on various markets to fund their invasion…viable?
Not a doctor. But while probably true that some poisons could cause very visible damage to some specific organs (liver, kidneys), but if you know what you are looking for, you could most likely find it in fat tissue, hair, nails.
I feel making extra cash on the side for mister important army officer “because is hard life to live” is most likely.
The Israeli army also does this with Palestinian prisoners. Israel has the worlds largest skin bank for some reason.
michaelmrose@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 16:21
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In regards to the Palestinians/Israelis this appears to be a malicious lie. If you look into it you see weird claims like poisoning people to take their organs (this ruins the organs) and taking people from graveyards for the recently killed (you don’t bury people and then come back for their shit) .
The allegations being a mix of unlikely claims and provable lies suggests there is no merit whatsoever to such claims.
FlorianSimon@sh.itjust.works
on 26 Jul 2024 16:39
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Any source on this I could read?
michaelmrose@lemmy.world
on 26 Jul 2024 19:21
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It is difficult to prove non-existence. Do you have some reliable sources I can read that show this behavior? Sources who preferably don’t make weird assertions or constantly spout provable lies in other respects? It doesn’t count if its a reliable source that is merely reporting “unreliable source says ___”
As an example if the Washington Post reported that $KNOWN_CRANK says ‘aliens are among us’ the Washington Post is taking ownership of the fact that $KNOWN_CRANK said not not the veracity of the crazy claim which is left to stand or fall entirely on the credibility of $KNOWN_CRANK.
threaded - newest
Oh that’s cool, live organ harvesting
Hmm who else has historically done this and was more or less supporting Russia…
Hmmm
Credibly? Israel. According to Adrien Zenz? China.
The correct answer is “nazis”
Why not all three?
Because the second one tries to wave away China’s attrocities as “not credible”. On par with an account ending with .ml
Yes, only this Zenz guy.
ohchr.org/…/china-un-human-rights-experts-alarmed…
theconversation.com/killing-prisoners-for-transpl…
bioethicstoday.org/…/forced-organ-harvesting-and-…
www.bmj.com/content/365/bmj.l4287
Found the .ml user
Russian troops gotta eat something.
“Blyat! Soylent Green, again!”
Gotta fund the war machine somehow.
Sick fucks
The Haruspex is at it again!
Tankies: “Russia is simply looking out for its sickest. Do you want them to die, you monster?!”
I mean… yes, if the price is harvesting organs from POWs. Not really even a controversial answer.
I see you haven’t talked to too many Tankies.
Oh, believe me, I have, and it’s great fun to troll them.
You know what, I’m pretty sure we’re going to hear some bullshit about “eastern worldview vs western world view” when it’s really just violent nationalism.
‘If confirmed’? I’d think the body being returned without internal organs would be confirmation enough.
What other excuse could Putin use? That rats got to the body and only ate the heart, liver and kidneys?
conventions are only suggestions if you’ve got nothing to lose
Ooh Russia has done it now.
Would this be the first Geneva violation? Or this is consisted worse than pillaging and raping?
Or kidnapping, or, you know, invading a sovereign nation.
In all fairness, Geneva doesn’t forbid war, just tries to set some humane rules.
That sentence broke my brain.
The point is that it’s not really confirmed. It’s like if putin says that they returned pow’s with boots up their asses, you wouldn’t just assume it’s true. I’m not saying it’s not true, but it also seems like a lot of work just to be a dickhead. I would assume they didn’t remove the organs in a way that they could be put to use again.
I would assume they wouldn’t go through the trouble of removing organs without a good reason, ie: to transplant into some rich Russian.
Does it still count if they remove the organs after the prisoner is already dead?
Friendly reminder the republiQans back russia.
Well, many do. Perjury Traitor Greed, Beavis, probably the Vaping Handjobber
I’d wait until it’s reported by bigger media channels with their reputation at the stake. Not only it’s stupid, easily provable, heinous, inhumane, but it’s also hard to carry it out, en masse and for no reason, with transplants being executed by select few clinics and less than a thousand of doctors. And having read a lot about prisons and army in USSR and modern Russia, I’ve seen a lot of morbid shit done to a living being, but yet to hear something about organized organ extraction from the dead. It also dawns on me that with how underfed and beaten POWs come back to Ukraine, there should’ve been a different camp to secure their health for their organs to be worth an operation.
Right now I mark it red but am open to rewiev that.
Who said anything about harvesting from the dead.
I’d assume dead once they are on the table knowing our sad state of medicine.
You seem to think they’re letting pows die and extracting organs later? Not much point in that.
You are the second person to point that out. That’s on me. No, I don’t think they choose dead or dying for transplants because, yes, the conditions leading to death and degenerative processes starting right after that render organs useless.
Sounds like Russians are harvesting live organs from living POW’s, then sending the victims’ remains back as a “fuck you” to the families.
Since Russia ignores the Geneva Convention, they should be excluded from it. Ukraine ahould be permitted to exterminate cockroaches inside of Russia.
the Geneva Conventions mostly exist to protect innocent people from war, they should never be ignored, no matter what.
The targets need not be civilian.
“They’re committing war crimes, so we’re committing war crimes” is a bad strategy that only leads to escalation.
Ok human fart
The Russians are violating an agreement. When a party leaves an agreement, there is no longer an agreement. It is impractical for one party to abide by this specific agreement when that party suffers death as a result.
No, that is not an excuse to do things like use poison gas, biological weapons or child soldiers. All that does is make things worse. It eventually leads to a nuclear weapon. I’m not sure why you don’t see where escalation leads.
I have not suggested any of those actions at all. Also, we are in disagreement about the threat of Putin’s ancient nuclear armament which has been maintained by notorious black-market scalpers for the past 50+ years.
You have not. You have suggested that war crimes are acceptable. All of those things are war crimes. Escalation to making war crimes acceptable make those things acceptable.
And it’s nice of you to be willing to sacrifice Kyiv because you don’t think any of Putin’s nukes work. I imagine Zelensky (and most of the rest of the Ukrainian population) don’t feel like that’s a risk that’s worth taking.
That’s a risk they are taking by fighting Putin at all. He’s drawn numerous lines in the sand using the threat of nuking Kyiv, all (or most) of which have been crossed. That’s why he’s escalated to threatening Europe and the West. Even he is not confident in his arsenal.
I concede that it is more wise to not push to the point of finding out if possible, but I do not believe bending to or negotiating with Putin would be useful in making Ukraine whole again. I also don’t think maintaining our current milquetoast approach to defending Ukraine is going to be effective either. I’m mostly in agreement with your positions, I’m just not in absolute agreement. I think a dramatic and swift action against Putin himself (a probable violation of Hague Conventions) would be an effective approach to ending the invasion.
I will hold my tongue on some other violations of international rules because they are vicious and I would (like most people) prefer we avoid them if possible. But, I think it would be an error to remove all such options dogmatically. I think Putin (and Russia at large) should be put on notice that when they refuse to play by the rules, the rules may be suspended in actions against them.
There is a massive gulf between not bending or negotiating and committing war crimes.
The allies were able to fight the Nazis without becoming the Nazis.
Agreed. I think that level of aggression is needed to solve this issue as well. We aren’t doing that, though. We are supporting Kyiv just enough to survive while the enemy ignores rule after rule against them.
Okay, but that’s a different subject. This started with the suggestion that if Russia is committing war crimes, Ukraine should as well.
It should be made clear to Russia that when they ignore the rules, they are removing the rules that protect them as well. I do not mean to suggest a blanket free-for-all of atrocities, but rather the crossing of some useful lines that we wouldn’t normally cross.
But you can rest assured no one is going to do anything because our leadership seems fine with Ukraine being slowly bled to death. Assassinations, explosive aggression and a bit of “unfair” behavior should be on the table to bring an end to this. Unfortunately, an end doesn’t seem to be our goal, as we are allowing this to last for years.
And I’m telling you, that leads to escalation. Russia will then do something worse. Should Ukraine do something worse to then in return? At what point does it stop?
Your point is valid. I disagree that such action should be avoided. Holding our current pattern will result in continued death of the innocent.
I believe a much more aggressive posture is needed to win. That posture should include threats that surprise and instill fear and should be followed with swift action (which does not necessarily include atrocities).
LMAO probably fake news but still funny
Trolls really have gotten worse lately, huh.
Straight out of the Israel playbook
Straight out of the Nazi playbook
Why’d you copy their comment?
Sorry, won’t do that again
In regards to the Palestinians/Israelis this appears to be a malicious lie. If you look into it you see weird claims like poisoning people to take their organs (this ruins the organs) and taking people from graveyards for the recently killed (you don’t bury people and then come back for their shit) .
The allegations being a mix of unlikely claims and provable lies suggests there is no merit whatsoever to such claims.
Only the biggest skin bank in the world, filled to the brim with non-citizen skin.
Was like this when we found it, is normal for kidneys to be lost from gunshot, da?
its quite normal to read such stuff in propaganda times, without them needing to happen at all. and it has always been like this.
This is awful. This is what happens when international laws are selectively enforced.
For the sake of innocent Ukrainians and innocents everywhere, someone needs to start enforcing the laws on everyone.
My unfounded conspiracy theory is that it is to hide certain torture and poisoning techniques. I have no knowledge on the subject, but it seems like a practical yet poorly thought out thing the orcs would do. Remove stomach and kidneys to hide stuff…then remove other things to obfuscate.
Also selling organs on various markets to fund their invasion…viable?
Not a doctor. But while probably true that some poisons could cause very visible damage to some specific organs (liver, kidneys), but if you know what you are looking for, you could most likely find it in fat tissue, hair, nails.
I feel making extra cash on the side for mister important army officer “because is hard life to live” is most likely.
The Israeli army also does this with Palestinian prisoners. Israel has the worlds largest skin bank for some reason.
In regards to the Palestinians/Israelis this appears to be a malicious lie. If you look into it you see weird claims like poisoning people to take their organs (this ruins the organs) and taking people from graveyards for the recently killed (you don’t bury people and then come back for their shit) .
The allegations being a mix of unlikely claims and provable lies suggests there is no merit whatsoever to such claims.
Any source on this I could read?
It is difficult to prove non-existence. Do you have some reliable sources I can read that show this behavior? Sources who preferably don’t make weird assertions or constantly spout provable lies in other respects? It doesn’t count if its a reliable source that is merely reporting “unreliable source says ___”
As an example if the Washington Post reported that $KNOWN_CRANK says ‘aliens are among us’ the Washington Post is taking ownership of the fact that $KNOWN_CRANK said not not the veracity of the crazy claim which is left to stand or fall entirely on the credibility of $KNOWN_CRANK.