FGM harms women’s physical and emotional health throughout their lives.[62][63] It has no known health benefits.[11]
There is no valid justification for FGM, cultural or otherwise. I do not care about comparisons to male circumcision. I do not care about the concerns of cultural relativism.
It is a brutal practice performed by barbaric people butchering women in a soulless, sinister, deeply cynical, and horrifically ignorant crime against humanity.
Bear the descriptions in the article at your own discretion.
I agree. Though I also think male circumcision of newborns should be banned. Not as a comparison, but simply because its a surgery with no benefit and measurable harm performed on people unable to consent. Just stop mutilating people.
I give zero fucks that someone’s imaginary friend told them it is necessary.
shawn1122@sh.itjust.works
on 18 Jun 00:21
nextcollapse
Both are born out of ancient ideals of purity and control over sexuality (the latter being especially applicable to FGM).
Male circumcision started because ancient humans viewed the human body as a canvas for social engineering. It survived and flourished because it successfully forged fierce tribal loyalty, distinct cultural boundaries, and deep religious identity. It was later justified as a way to curb masturbation.
FGM, in ancient stratified societies, including Egypt and Rome, became a prerequisite for marriage. It signified a woman’s obedience, purity, and readiness to join a household. In several cultures, an uncut woman was deemed “unclean” and socially ostracized, making her unmarriageable.
The foundational justification in almost all practicing cultures was to reduce a woman’s libido. By removing sensitive tissue, societies sought to ensure a girl remained a virgin until marriage and faithful to her husband afterward.
Both practices are a type of mutilation in my opinion but one is not referred to that way due to cultural relativism. I’m glad to come from a part of the world where neither is or ever was the norm.
I know the reasons for both. And for both they are either based in cruelty or bullshit. The origin doesn’t matter. What matters is what we do now, and what cruelty we allow to continue.
shawn1122@sh.itjust.works
on 18 Jun 01:35
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Knowing how / why is meaningful context in my opinion, simply to make it apparent how archaic the foundation really is. Especially when there are people in 2026 arguing in favor of such practices.
I disagree. The reasons behind cruelty are irrelevant. If it is cruel, that is all that matters. If people try to justify their cruelty, then I can write them off as people worth engaging with.
I’m tired of trying to make sense of the justifications of cruelty and hatred. The reasoning doesn’t matter, the result does.
shawn1122@sh.itjust.works
on 18 Jun 02:28
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To each their own. I’m fascinated by how societies may normalize and justify such practices over time but I am a student of history. The why often helps to eliminate the regressive practice in a sustainable way.
I understand wanting to know from am academic perspective, but I no longer believe that it matters for eliminating regressive policies and practices.
The holocaust is one of the most studied tragedies in history. That understanding has done nothing to eliminate genocide.
The Jim Crow laws have been studied and the motivations behind them are well known. Yet those same motivations and strategies are still being used to divide the US.
People largely don’t care. A huge portion of the population doesn’t care about an issue until they are personally impacted.
CatAssTrophy@safest.space
on 18 Jun 07:26
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Not necessarily, at least with regards to historical justifications of male circumcision. For example, desert cultures that had extremely limited chances for things like baths experienced high rates of infection that circumcision notably reduced. And with a high rate of phimosis, the choice between infant circumcision (with lower blood loss, faster healing times and lower rates of complications) and teenage+ circumcision (with worse healing and a higher rate of complications). If 1/3 of your boys and men have to undergo circumcision for medical reasons, is it not better to do it when its the quickest to heal?
Even now, there is significant evidence that male circumcision reduces the chances of HIV (and other STD) transfer in susceptible populations, so circumcision in at risk populations is the common medical recommendation.
I in no way support circumcision as a routine religious/cultural practice, but when there are times and places and societies where it is a genuine harm reduction technique, and throwing those babies out with that bathwater isn’t really helpful, either.
Tollana1234567@lemmy.today
on 18 Jun 04:58
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not at birth, apparently when you develop things like chronic balantitis(not due to infeciton), or something that scars the tissue around the opening it might be prudent to remove it. religious reasons is just asasine.
Sometimes, yes. When they’re done without consent or emotionally pressured or coerced upon children too young to be capable of informed consent, yes. Consenting adults, fine. Consenting teens or even tweens, fine. Teen who feels socially pressured? No. 5-year-old? No. This is not something that affects your future. This is not something that has some medical or preventive purpose.
Ear piercings may only cause minor pain and have minor infection risks and may not be a serious harm in the great scheme of things, but they set a horrible precedent for consent and bodily autonomy and I find it unconscionable that anyone can defend that unless they are just expressing how normalized it is because of the way it happened to them too. Beauty standards for women are oppressive things that even women tend to unwittingly enforce on each other, and it starts during childhood. It’s not good, it’s not healthy. It’s sick, and it’s malicious, and we need to stop perpetuating it. Let people have the bodies they are born with and accept them as they are, let them decide if or when they want to change it.
My ears being pierced doesn’t harm me physically, but it does remind me that I used to be someone’s property and that I could be again. I think “it would look cute” is not a valid reason to violate someone’s bodily autonomy.
Equinox1289@sh.itjust.works
on 17 Jun 22:36
nextcollapse
Genital mutilation is a terrible practice often done on unconsenting young children for bs cultural reasons. These traditions need to stop. Everyone has a right to genital integrity!
RichardNixos@lemmy.ml
on 18 Jun 01:44
nextcollapse
Big “my parents spanked me and I turned out just fine” energy
theuniqueone@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 18 Jun 01:46
nextcollapse
I’m sure she will change her mind ounce shown the hundreds of study. /s Everyone demanding “reliable data” always does./s
ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net
on 18 Jun 05:51
nextcollapse
As the great president Selina Mayer once said, “don’t we in the US practice male circumcision on boys, who are as young as just tiny babies, so… glass houses.”
raspberriesareyummy@lemmy.world
on 18 Jun 06:50
nextcollapse
While I agree with the sentiment, the scale of the mutilation and consequences is not comparable.
ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net
on 18 Jun 07:18
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They are on a different scale by definitely comparable. Non consenting children are subjected to unnecessary medical procedure, often with adverse effects. You know that babies in US have died because mohels gave them herpes when sucking on circumcision wound? (www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6122a2.htm). Yet it’s legal in US…
Yes, let’s intentionally break our glass house by throwing much deserved stones at something else. Once it’s broken, we’ll replace it with a house that isn’t made of glass and doesn’t tolerate the mutilation of children of either gender. This is not about assigning blame or deciding who’s right or wrong, and it’s disingenuous and distracting to try to compare them, maintain your focus on stopping the practices.
She might already have it, hence the reason she thinks it’s fine. People think abuse builds character. There’s all kinds of ways to live with and spread your own trauma.
Oh oh oh, how like most Americans are religiously for circumcision, mostly because it would be annoying to think someone’s robbed them of sexual function by mutilating their genitals as a baby?
Exactly. I had my dick snipped. I also requested my son’s was snipped. I was stupid. I should have known better, but I was too Americman for knowing better. I already knew better. I would say things like, “it’s better for hygiene” or “helps prevent premature ejaculation in old age” (like it was some kind of gross favor). So yeah, yeah… I fucking know.
zergtoshi@lemmy.world
on 18 Jun 08:24
nextcollapse
Disgusting.
I wouldn’t understand that position if she were male and unserstand it even less so.
Vergissmeinnicht@lemmy.ca
on 18 Jun 15:28
collapse
if she doesn’t have any data on the benefits (and she doesn’t, because there aren’t) then the question regarding harms is moot to begin with. Don’t cut up children’s bodies without a medical necessity, period.
threaded - newest
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_mutilation
There is no valid justification for FGM, cultural or otherwise. I do not care about comparisons to male circumcision. I do not care about the concerns of cultural relativism.
It is a brutal practice performed by barbaric people butchering women in a soulless, sinister, deeply cynical, and horrifically ignorant crime against humanity.
Bear the descriptions in the article at your own discretion.
I agree. Though I also think male circumcision of newborns should be banned. Not as a comparison, but simply because its a surgery with no benefit and measurable harm performed on people unable to consent. Just stop mutilating people.
I give zero fucks that someone’s imaginary friend told them it is necessary.
Both are born out of ancient ideals of purity and control over sexuality (the latter being especially applicable to FGM).
Male circumcision started because ancient humans viewed the human body as a canvas for social engineering. It survived and flourished because it successfully forged fierce tribal loyalty, distinct cultural boundaries, and deep religious identity. It was later justified as a way to curb masturbation.
FGM, in ancient stratified societies, including Egypt and Rome, became a prerequisite for marriage. It signified a woman’s obedience, purity, and readiness to join a household. In several cultures, an uncut woman was deemed “unclean” and socially ostracized, making her unmarriageable.
The foundational justification in almost all practicing cultures was to reduce a woman’s libido. By removing sensitive tissue, societies sought to ensure a girl remained a virgin until marriage and faithful to her husband afterward.
Both practices are a type of mutilation in my opinion but one is not referred to that way due to cultural relativism. I’m glad to come from a part of the world where neither is or ever was the norm.
I know the reasons for both. And for both they are either based in cruelty or bullshit. The origin doesn’t matter. What matters is what we do now, and what cruelty we allow to continue.
Knowing how / why is meaningful context in my opinion, simply to make it apparent how archaic the foundation really is. Especially when there are people in 2026 arguing in favor of such practices.
I disagree. The reasons behind cruelty are irrelevant. If it is cruel, that is all that matters. If people try to justify their cruelty, then I can write them off as people worth engaging with.
I’m tired of trying to make sense of the justifications of cruelty and hatred. The reasoning doesn’t matter, the result does.
To each their own. I’m fascinated by how societies may normalize and justify such practices over time but I am a student of history. The why often helps to eliminate the regressive practice in a sustainable way.
I understand wanting to know from am academic perspective, but I no longer believe that it matters for eliminating regressive policies and practices.
The holocaust is one of the most studied tragedies in history. That understanding has done nothing to eliminate genocide.
The Jim Crow laws have been studied and the motivations behind them are well known. Yet those same motivations and strategies are still being used to divide the US.
People largely don’t care. A huge portion of the population doesn’t care about an issue until they are personally impacted.
Not necessarily, at least with regards to historical justifications of male circumcision. For example, desert cultures that had extremely limited chances for things like baths experienced high rates of infection that circumcision notably reduced. And with a high rate of phimosis, the choice between infant circumcision (with lower blood loss, faster healing times and lower rates of complications) and teenage+ circumcision (with worse healing and a higher rate of complications). If 1/3 of your boys and men have to undergo circumcision for medical reasons, is it not better to do it when its the quickest to heal?
Even now, there is significant evidence that male circumcision reduces the chances of HIV (and other STD) transfer in susceptible populations, so circumcision in at risk populations is the common medical recommendation.
I in no way support circumcision as a routine religious/cultural practice, but when there are times and places and societies where it is a genuine harm reduction technique, and throwing those babies out with that bathwater isn’t really helpful, either.
not at birth, apparently when you develop things like chronic balantitis(not due to infeciton), or something that scars the tissue around the opening it might be prudent to remove it. religious reasons is just asasine.
I agree, same with ear piercings.
Ear piercings harm women’s physical and emotional health?
Sometimes, yes. When they’re done without consent or emotionally pressured or coerced upon children too young to be capable of informed consent, yes. Consenting adults, fine. Consenting teens or even tweens, fine. Teen who feels socially pressured? No. 5-year-old? No. This is not something that affects your future. This is not something that has some medical or preventive purpose.
Ear piercings may only cause minor pain and have minor infection risks and may not be a serious harm in the great scheme of things, but they set a horrible precedent for consent and bodily autonomy and I find it unconscionable that anyone can defend that unless they are just expressing how normalized it is because of the way it happened to them too. Beauty standards for women are oppressive things that even women tend to unwittingly enforce on each other, and it starts during childhood. It’s not good, it’s not healthy. It’s sick, and it’s malicious, and we need to stop perpetuating it. Let people have the bodies they are born with and accept them as they are, let them decide if or when they want to change it.
My ears being pierced doesn’t harm me physically, but it does remind me that I used to be someone’s property and that I could be again. I think “it would look cute” is not a valid reason to violate someone’s bodily autonomy.
Genital mutilation is a terrible practice often done on unconsenting young children for bs cultural reasons. These traditions need to stop. Everyone has a right to genital integrity!
Everyone, regardless of male, female or intersex.
Christians and Jews dont get an exception.
Based AF right there
Big “my parents spanked me and I turned out just fine” energy
I’m sure she will change her mind ounce shown the hundreds of study. /s Everyone demanding “reliable data” always does./s
As the great president Selina Mayer once said, “don’t we in the US practice male circumcision on boys, who are as young as just tiny babies, so… glass houses.”
While I agree with the sentiment, the scale of the mutilation and consequences is not comparable.
They are on a different scale by definitely comparable. Non consenting children are subjected to unnecessary medical procedure, often with adverse effects. You know that babies in US have died because mohels gave them herpes when sucking on circumcision wound? (www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6122a2.htm). Yet it’s legal in US…
Yes, let’s intentionally break our glass house by throwing much deserved stones at something else. Once it’s broken, we’ll replace it with a house that isn’t made of glass and doesn’t tolerate the mutilation of children of either gender. This is not about assigning blame or deciding who’s right or wrong, and it’s disingenuous and distracting to try to compare them, maintain your focus on stopping the practices.
Both are bad. Why are you trying to change the subject to the US? You can make your own thread for that.
She should have it, so she can experience it and make a call. 🤷
This is the best approach. Wonder what excuses she’ll come up with to cop out.
She might already have it, hence the reason she thinks it’s fine. People think abuse builds character. There’s all kinds of ways to live with and spread your own trauma.
Oh oh oh, how like most Americans are religiously for circumcision, mostly because it would be annoying to think someone’s robbed them of sexual function by mutilating their genitals as a baby?
Exactly. I had my dick snipped. I also requested my son’s was snipped. I was stupid. I should have known better, but I was too Americman for knowing better. I already knew better. I would say things like, “it’s better for hygiene” or “helps prevent premature ejaculation in old age” (like it was some kind of gross favor). So yeah, yeah… I fucking know.
Disgusting.
I wouldn’t understand that position if she were male and unserstand it even less so.
if she doesn’t have any data on the benefits (and she doesn’t, because there aren’t) then the question regarding harms is moot to begin with. Don’t cut up children’s bodies without a medical necessity, period.