EU formally approves €90bn Ukraine loan and 20th sanctions package against Russia
(www.theguardian.com)
from perestroika@slrpnk.net to world@lemmy.world on 23 Apr 18:34
https://slrpnk.net/post/36938814
from perestroika@slrpnk.net to world@lemmy.world on 23 Apr 18:34
https://slrpnk.net/post/36938814
Speaking later, von der Leyen said she thought it would be possible to disburse the first tranche of the €45bn funding planned for 2026 in this quarter, meaning by the end of June. The first payment, she indicated, would fund Ukraine’s domestic drone production – “drones from Ukraine for Ukraine”.
#world
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IMHO, with this sum, Ukraine can finance enough drone production to saturate and overwhelm Russia’s air defense regularly, and regularly bomb industries which the Russian war effort relies on, with enough drones to disable them.
It is unlikely that Russia will stop producing drones and doing the same, but starting from this summer, it will take damage to strategically important places on a weekly basis, and might run out of money to finance things.
If one looks at polls from “levada.ru”, Putin’s popularity is already dropping at a rapid rate for some months. Hopefully this will accelerate.
The remaining question is: how exactly will the war end? Hopefully with negotiations, but other scenarios are possible. It could be economic crisis, strikes and protests in Russia. Or a coup. But it could also be escalation to weapons of mass destruction. The role of Ukraine’s allies should be to deter Russia from using that last option.
The best way to deter Russia from using Nukes would be to stop funding Ukraine, stop saddling them with unpayable debt, and stop using them to threaten Russia. Let’s say Ukraine pushes Russia over the edge by damaging civilian infrastructure, then what? Ukraine gets nuked and they can’t even pay the interest on their loans.
Nobody is going to nuke Russia back for nuking Ukraine. It’s been over for them on the ground for a while. Now we’re testing drones and making Ukraine pay for the weapons project by taking out debt. In a few years there may not be a Ukraine, just a crater where it used to be.
If you go damage someone’s infrastructure, shouldn’t you expect your infrastructure to get damaged in return?
Depends. Last I checked Russia wasn’t explicitly targeting civilians and infrastructure like power plants, schools and hospitals, unlike the Israelis and Americans.
Did Putin tell you that?
Comrade, you need a little more subtilty. Your propaganda sucks
EvergreenGuru@lemmy.world wrote:
You checked badly then. Just to bring the most poignant example.
en.wikipedia.org/…/Human_safari_(terror_campaign)
So last time you checked was, like, 2013? You should keep yourself better informed.
The problem with your moronic hypotheticals is that Ukraine focuses on military and oil infra, they are not like russia and aiming at civilian infra.
And how about we let Ukraine decide what they want to do. If they want to keep fighting, we will support them. If they want to surrender, we will have to support them.
I recommend you take a history lesson before you suggest stupid shit like we appeasing genocidal dictators. I’m disappointed to know that theres stupid fucks in Lemmy as well. I guess its impossible to escape you guys.
To be paid by Russia from reparations. If reparations won’t be obtained, Ukraine won’t have to repay this.
As for the last point, I believe Russia has been repeatedly assured, gently and behind the scenes, that if forbidden weapons are used, then some flavour of doomsday will come. Now the assurance only depends too heavily on French and UK systems, since the US is suffering from mad president syndrome.
The reassuring thing is that Ukraine has worn Russian air defense so thin during the years, that an assurance from France and UK is now credible. The mistake of invading Ukraine has considerably weakened Russia’s deterrents, and infiltration by Ukraine has limited Russia’s ability to achieve surprise.
To be paid by Russia from reparations.You’re delusional. Do you also believe that the US is going to build a wall and make Mexico pay for it? 😂
I’m helping you understand the terms of the loan, which you mis-represented while spreading propaganda.
It doesn’t work this way.
Imagine giving up before trying to survive
Though the word bufferstate should forever be a shameful word used with reluctance there is enough reason to believe retaliation is imminent when an action has direct consequences on the nations within the EU already
That’s already happening. The money means Ukraine can continue for a long time and Russia can’t simply wait them out.
I’m wondering the same. What does it matter if his popularity drops? Wouldn’t it just continue until he is dead or there’s a wave of massive, violent strikes and protests — large enough for the ruling class to fear for their lives?
A drop in popularity would be a strong incentive to negotiate a solution, because they aren’t fools.
If propaganda is no longer working and critical thresholds are passed (“the fridge defeats the TV”) and government workers feel that status no longer protects them, then a wave of protest can’t be far. When it comes to protest, sadly it will be violent in Russia - because previous protest has been violently dealt with.
Putin and his elite will definitely want to avoid that.
Putin will never agree to pay reparations. The EU should simply be happy that the money is being used to stop Russian aggression. Hopefully that’s enough. If not, Europe would have to send in troops. Candidates for sending in troops are Britain and France. Too many European countries can’t send in troops because Putin would complain that Russia is being overwhelmed and must go nuclear.
They dont have to go nuclear, they can just hop back on their side of the border and build a huge wall, hey, we’ll even help them build it from the opposite side so that we’ll never have to deal with their spilling madness again.
And absolutely nothing bad happened to Hungary as a result. See how easy that was?
The EU is giving Ukraine another lifeline to fight on. But with whose men, though?
Ukraine has drone fighting to an art form. They took a Russian emplacement entirely with drones and ground robots last week.
To maintain production of an overwhelming force of drones to kill invaders and knock out Russian infrastructure.
I agree EU countries need to do more, like sending troops. But this so called lifeline keeps them going, so it’s a start. They need more drones, robots and ammo.
Suck it Orban!
hope they sanction israel with the same intensity
One can hope, but sadly, there is a difference in EU responses. There is no consensus and nothing gets done. :o