Trump’s US doesn’t just think Europe is obsolete – it wants to see it dead
(www.theguardian.com)
from MicroWave@lemmy.world to world@lemmy.world on 31 Mar 11:12
https://lemmy.world/post/27609480
from MicroWave@lemmy.world to world@lemmy.world on 31 Mar 11:12
https://lemmy.world/post/27609480
Summary
The “Signalgate” scandal confirms the Trump administration’s deep disdain for Europe, viewing it not just as obsolete but actively wanting its demise.
There are 3 major implications: an inevitable trade war where Europe must unite; continued US pressure on Greenland despite European pushback; and Europe needing to support Ukraine not just without US help, but potentially against US interests.
European leaders who stand firm against US bullying are seeing rising approval ratings.
Europe should “with firmness, courage and politeness” chart its own path forward.
#world
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Europe is a comparative bastion of liberal democracy, hardly suprising facists dont like us
It’s the south, they hate that the coasts respect Europe more, and that it’s generally atheist (atheist in their mind means anything outside of evangelical southern baptists, ie the true religion).
But Europe has the literal Vatican! That’s where the religion comes from!
Oh my sweet summer child, you just opened the door to madness.
Southern baptists don’t…they don’t consider catholics to be Christians.
Not ‘catholics aren’t real Christians’ or ‘catholics are heretics’, they’re not Christian at all, they’re like Mormons or Muslims.
I have never managed to understand it, and I had a few SBC try to explain it to me, their attitude is just that it’s not real Christianity like protestantism, it’s something else, something alien.
This is why Irish and Italians weren’t considered white for a long time too, only really white people can be Christian, because of the curse of Ham. Black people like Obama are straight Muslim, full stop.
Feel free to go down this rabbit hole, it won’t get you anywhere good, and the sbc has been trying to quietly backpedal as best they can, but it’s still really popular among the smaller congregations, at least the ones I met.
Which makes it extra ironic the so-called White House faith office is pulling shit like selling $1,000 Easter miracles.
That’s practically the old Catholic indulgences and those were literally one of the reasons for the great schism; that kind of shit is why Protestants exist to begin with THAT’S WHAT THEY WERE PROTESTING
They have so utterly and comprehensively lost the plot and betrayed everything they claimed to stand for
The sbc never, ever claimed to stand for anything except being pro-slavery.
That’s why they schismed from the triennial convention, to endorse the Curse of Ham as core dogma for God to command white men to keep black people as slaves.
I was dumbfounded the first time my ex-wife tried to tell me that because I was a (former) Catholic at the time, that it wasn’t actually Christianity.
My exact words were; “Bitch please! We were the fucking original christians, what the fuck are you on about?”
That was before we got married and I should have listened to my gut in that moment.
This heretic doesn’t know about East-West schism. OG Christians are Orthodox
come at me, bro…
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.ca/pictrs/image/c6f3c596-81b8-4abe-a582-ab56f56ac23a.jpeg">
I was raised Roman Catholic and I was taught about the schism.
However, it was framed as the Eastern Orthodox Catholics broke off from mainstream Catholicism, therefore Roman Catholics were the “original Catholics.”
It does kind of tickle me how much the folks that taught me that, value tradition so highly that they try to rationalize this kind of thing until they once are “traditional.”
Southern Baptiats after schisming in order to make the Curse of Ham their dogmatic rationalization of slavery:
<img alt="" src="https://lemm.ee/pictrs/image/c85e4224-93a4-43a1-a75b-54e8831f9138.jpeg">
Interesting. Wild, but interesting. I consider Mormons to be Christian too, I didn’t realize it was its own thing, I thought it was just the blanket term for religions that worship Jesus.
Don’t sweat it, everyone is just gatekeeping, because only their specific religion is true and everyone else is just evil and siding with Satan.
And they’re all mutually exclusive! So if you’re religious and believe in one of the various Christian offshoots (or really, any faith of Abrahamic origin), no matter which one you pick, you’re going to hell according to most of the others.
youtu.be/D88DQIJmxRI
Same reason they hate Canada.
I think you mean colonialism and white supremacy.
As an Asian, please go fuck yourself.
We had just as much, if not far more cruelty to our own people, for instance our caste system was really just charming.
The British brought rule of law, sanitation and medicine, and they stopped the monstrous Muslims from genociding us every time they felt like it.
Seems like a great trade to me.
Are you from india?
Born in America, and that’s about all I identify as.
But the Muslims were absolutely brutal to my ancestors.
Right? What is this nonsense lol. Go and tell Belgian congo about being a bastion of liberal democracy 😂😂😂
This is why “living in interesting times” is a curse. Give me the boring decades where nothing happens.
Yeah that was always meant as a curse
A couple issues.
The Signal chat didn’t show that anyone wanted Europe dead. Agree or not, it showed that the administration wants Europe to be responsible for their own military interests (As though the US received nothing from being the security for the West over the past 75 years.)
If they want to see Europe destroyed, those receipts have to come from elsewhere.
Secondly, helping Ukraine is in everyone’s interest except for Trump and the GOP. Stopping the stupid fucking tariffs is in America’s interests. Trump succumbing to his age is in America’s interests.
Don’t confuse America’s interests with those of the people who want to destroy and weaken America. Other than that, the point is correct. Europe needs to be much more active in Ukraine, even if the US administration may object.
US as a security of the west is like running next to a bull to stay safe (better not wear anything red). They were never protecting other nations, but rather their business interests/opportunities. Look at the last example of “protection” deal. “Sign over minerals.”; “And then you will protect us, right?”; “You do not hold the cards.”… It’s more like finding an exploit, labeling terrorists/freedom fighters, deploying troops (“Say thank you troops”), kill anyone resisting the deal – profit.
You’re a fucking joke if you think the last two months is representative of the US over the past 75 years.
The difference these last few months has been the lack of any restraint when talking about it, because of the incredibly low IQ of people in charge rn. When did US ever engage in war without securing wealth or land? Selfless defence is not even on the list of general reasons for war. Number one is economic gain. It’s always a defence contract or straight up looting. When all you have is a hammer…
I assure you, the recent differences are more than just talk.
You're a fucking joke if you think that the last 2 months won't have ripple effects outside of the US for the next 75 years.
I’d argue that the last two months have been the culmination of the last ~50 years of US fascism.
I heard someone defederated from Hexbear, but I didn’t think it was us.
TBF, they want everyone dead.
That’s because Trump’s US is actually Putin’s US. And Putin wants Europe weak and malleable.
Not necessarily, they just want to make Europe white again and aren’t very professional.
But of course. Democratic countries doing very well with policies far more socialist than would be politically expedient for the US? Can’t have that.
This is capitalism. There are no “allies” in the race to destroy the planet.
Meanwhile I’m trying to figure out how best to flee the US and set up in Denmark or some similar place with a much higher quality of life and fewer 21st century Nazis.
Careful with Denmark. Our immigration laws have become pretty strict. We’re also a pretty tiny country.
Unfortunately a lot of European countries have been going down that dark path, just not as far along as the US. I’m cautiously hopeful that the current events will help steer us back in the right direction but we’ll see…
Curious, why are strict immigration laws a “dark path”?
Look at the US reasoning for their strict immigration and realize its the same motivations.
You really believe Denmark is looking at the Trump’s administration approach as something to model itself after? What are the common issues Denmark is facing that match the US response?
Listening to those that push for strict immigration in Europe you could easily confuse them for Republicans.
Now that just sounds like the arguments from the other far-right party in America in the Cultural Wars used to distract the people from the actual lack of economic prosperity and quality of life for the many.
“Strict immigration policies” needs not be the “so bad we even betray those we invited in” shit of the far-right: something as simple as having limited numbers per year and preferring the provision of help to the worse off refugees rather than economic migrants is a “strict immigration policy” whilst actually being a pretty Leftwing and Humanitarian posture.
It’s reasonable that countries which are wealtier can’t just allow anybody out of the other billions of human beings living in places which aren’t as wealthy to come over and settle there, simply because several times the local population worth of people with far lower average education who can’t even speak the local language coming over will basically destroy the very reason the country is a properous as it is (mainly because those people will be far less productive than the locals but still consume roughly the same amount of resources per-capita).
(This is without even going into the cultural clashes and subsequent rise of the far-right that happen when people from totally different cultures move to a country in large numbers within a short time period)
Once one accepts that no-limits immigration is mathematically and socially destructive, the conversation can then moves into the world of the possible, such as how to make sure it’s the most deserving who get invited in, helping those who come integrate (as social clashes with immigrants are almost always just prejudice against the unknown and mismatched cultural expectations), managing the pressures of all those new people on infrastructure and so on: that’s things like activelly looking for the worst off people in refugee camps in the worst areas and helping those (including inviting them over), adult education including of the local language to that those coming in can become fully productive citizens of their adopted country, making sure housing markets are properly supplying demand to reduce the pressure of the population growth associated with immigration and so on.
Immigration policy needs not be the anti-other hostility to the point of kicking out the very people who have been invited in (quite extreme when you think that treating one’s guests well is an important element of lots of cultures) of the far-right, but it can’t be the pie-in-the-sky open door policies of neoliberals cosplaying as lefties with Identity Politics.
Ultimatelly there have to be limits of a “number of people per time unit” kind, the difference between the rightwing take and the leftwing take is the criteria for chosing who gets in if there are more candidates than the limits.
Good luck. If you don’t pass as a refugee, you just need money, a job, a place to live and to prove all that to the central bureaucracy
The USA is well its way to becoming a danger to other countries and a force of evil in the world.
Worse… It appears this change is intentional and deliberate
Meaning they plan on it getting much much worse
Lol