German teens denied entry to US for traveling ‘under false pretenses’ and ‘intended to work’: Border Patrol
(nypost.com)
from cyrano@lemmy.dbzer0.com to world@lemmy.world on 22 Apr 07:14
https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/42769336
from cyrano@lemmy.dbzer0.com to world@lemmy.world on 22 Apr 07:14
https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/post/42769336
The teens claimed CBP targeted them because they hadn’t booked hotels for their entire stay in Hawaii.
“They found it suspicious that we hadn’t fully booked our accommodations for the entire five weeks in Hawaii,” Pohl said. “We wanted to travel spontaneously. Just like we had done in Thailand and New Zealand.”
#world
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They never think it could happen to them until it does. It already happened to Germans months ago tho and there was lots of press coverage, so this case of “i didnt know” is extra odd. I guess people just dont pay attention to actual relevant news.
As far as I know it wasn’t all that widespread news in Germany, at least on the channels I see. Besides, ppl. have a tendency to think that something would never happen to them.
They were teenagers who had spent the last 5 weeks traveling the world. They probably just didn’t think keeping up with developments in the US was important. That plus a healthy dose of white privilege (and probably a wealthy background given that they were teenagers on a world tour) telling them oppression was something that happens to other people.
Agreed. As a white German woman myself, I can tell you that we are very used to being above any suspicion. I have been waved on in every traffic control and border check I’ve ever been in.
Also the German passport is one of the strongest in the world, we can basically go wherever we want when travelling. And now suddenly the US of all places is a country we have to be cautious in.
This is of course a very privileged position to be in, but they are teenagers, they probably haven’t had to think about that until now.
I don’t get it. Why would anyone still travel to the US without being forced to?
I wouldn’t go to USA even if you pay me. To be “mistakenly” deported to El Salvador and then they fucking “don’t know” how to get you out. Fuck no.
I used to say this about 3rd world countries to avoid them, now USA is on that list. Imagine USA being that bad. Well, it is that bad now. When it was under Biden, I wouldn’t even think about it. With this orange baboon, no fucking chance you see me go to USA.
Even before, having to be treated like cattle in their border checks for hours? No thank you.
There’s a significant amount of the US population who still don’t realise how bad things are, you really expect everyone outside the US to be any better?
I assure you, everyone outside of the US knows how bad the US is… the US is the laughing stock of the world right now. We get daily reminders how shit it is, how shit the economy is, how many mass shootings there were today. The world is fascinated by it, sometimes bored.
In this case with the young travellers, they have probably had the holiday booked for ages. Some people just think it wouldn’t happen to them. These sorts of checks would seem random anyway. These sorts of things appear on near every episode of Border Patrol (in Australia) where someone is being sent home because of lack of funds to sustain their length of stay etc…
Ah yes, the hive mind of all non US citizens sharing the same knowledge.
Which bit are you objecting to? If you don’t believe that the US is being portrayed by every news agency (worldwide) as a dumpster fire, you are deluded
You’d be surpised by how many people don’t follow international news.
It’s not just in the news. My husband is a lawyer. He was on a training conference today. Part of it was about how the rule of law needs to be followed and society only works when it is. They then discussed how important it was to upkeep that using America as an example of a government no longer following rule of law. This wasn’t internet memes. This was senior legal minds discussing how American democracy is failing.
Most people aren’t lawyers.
Whilst you’re absolutelly right that not everybody outside the US follows what’s going on in the US, it makes sense to expect that the universe of people who have the money and inclination to go spend a whole month travelling in the US AND are not at all aware of what’s going on in the US, is miniscule - if you’re a middle class person in a wealthy enough country (hence you can afford the plane ticket and the costs of 1 month worth of accomodation and travelling around the US), who can speak English and who is interested in the US that you want to spending a whole month travelling there, you’re almost certainly paying attention to all things America and since what’s has been popping up in the news all over the World, you’re almost certainly aware of that.
I mean, I can understand how poor people in Latin American who would want to immigrate to the US by walking all the way there might not be up to date with what’s going on in the US or at least fully understand the implications, but that doesn’t make sense for actual European tourists who can afford to and chose to fly there and spend an whole month there.
I get that. My point is that in arenas that have usually nothing to do with the USA, it’s being talked about as fact that the USA is in a failed state at the moment.
It doesn’t have the dramatics of things like 9/11 that changed the world irrevocably. However, it’s a similar feeling for those not in the USA. The world has changed and won’t be the same. You don’t have to follow the news to be aware.
… don’t use social media, and don’t talk to anybody that does those things (because it’s basically impossible for it to not enter normal conversation).
Yeah, there certainly exist some people like this. But I doubt they are the ones booking international trips.
Oh, they definitly on social media and talk to people. But that still doesn’t mean you’re exposed to US politics. People have their own domestic politics to talk about. What happens in the US really isn’t as relevant to the daily life of the average foreigner as you might think.
I wonder where you’re from. In the parts of Europe I know it seems to be everywhere, all the media, all the information channels, just inescapable. And it’s not US politics, it’s international politics - tariffs, visas, research financing, USAID, military alliances, new territory ambitions - these are not US internal politics, it influences other countries in a massive way.
Only if you’re terminally online.
But for the people that get their news from TV and printed newspaper … or maybe facebook, US poltics is a sidenote. The sports segments are usually twice as long as the international politics segment, for example. Sure, they probably heard about the tarrifs in some form, but a lot of people just don’t care about that.
TV, newpapers and facebook is what I’m talking about. I’m the only lemmy person in my real life bubble.
Well yeah, there are two types of people in the world: Americans and Not-Americans. So these Not-American teenagers would certainly be fully aware of the current political climate in America.
I would guess we as outsiders think it’s worse than it is, hearing only the bad stuff. We’re not hearing about great new sales at bed bath and beyond or whatever, we’re only hearing about the heavy handed deportations and human rights violations. Which is obviously bad but its easy to confuse “probably not as bad as it sounds” with “probably not actually that bad”.
I don’t think I’m communicating the point i was trying to make very well but whatever
I think you’re saying that we/I in the USA still see/have the trappings of normalcy: ads for BB&B, our Amazon packages are still delivered, we still have our treats.
Y’all outside of the USA don’t care about our treats. Y’all’s news is showing all the human rights erosions and ignoring that I got new prescription glasses by mail just 2 business days after ordering them (what a successful and stable country this must be/s!).
(sidenote, maybe prescription glasses aren’t treats, but I’m very excited because my prescription has changed and maybe I will stop with these eye strain headaches)
I assure you, most don’t. Message boards don’t contain mist people
Ok… so why do they still travel to the us? Do they know how bad things are but are just stupid?
tariffs hasnt hit the shelves yet for most people, so they are still ignorant to the situation. also they dont think rfk jrs, autism database will affect them yet.
Read the article - they clearly don’t read the news, and had no idea that other Germans had already been detained.
like didn’t Germany issue a travel warning?
It was explicitly not a travel warning (“don’t go there”) but a note to be aware that an ESTA does not guarantee entry to the US. Because our authorities are lame and still want to avoid looking like they’re somehow opposed to anything the US does.
That’s actually both lame and stupid considering that getting detained by ICE is almost a guarantee
Yeeees but the US is, of course, a VALUED and RELIABLE partner and has been for decades and we, the new German government, look forward to an increasedly productive collaboration with the new Trump government regarding global matters etc. pp. bl. er. gh. 🤮
Almost all Germans entering the US are detained by ICE? They must have a lot of agents on standby for every Lufthansa flight.
People travel to China because there is nice stuff to see and great food to try. While US doesn't have the great food they have the nice stuff to see and are still way better than China.
Ngl right now id rather travel to China. If I dont do anything particularly dumb it looks good for them right now to have normal tourism working, particularly when the US is being this shit.
That’s just ignorant. There’s plenty of absolutely fantastic food in the U.S.
I have no idea why anyone would visit us now, but if you manage to get past the fascist scum, there are plenty of amazing places to eat.
They were also going to Hawaii specifically. Now I’m German and have never set foot in any US state but I’d imagine Hawaii as a tropical island group would have its own local cuisine that can’t be half-bad (if you ignore the lack of beer), right?
Pork and pineapple
Exaaactly, Toast Hawaii is a staple of any good German Hausfrau. We love that shit.
As a resident of Hawaii, I have no idea what Toast Hawaii is.
Whaaaat you’re telling me toast with a slice of ham, a slice of pineapple and a slice of melted cheese on top ISN’T a centuries old traditional Hawaiian meal? The GIs have misled us!
It even has an English language entry in Wikipedia: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toast_Hawaii
<img alt="Photo of Toast Hawaii" src="https://feddit.org/pictrs/image/a2ae9000-1a31-49b6-966a-0aa68e8d9c8b.jpeg">
(I am being very unserious :))
It being based on Spam is pretty accurate to the name. We love spam and use it all over the place. One of the most iconic local snacks is the spam musubi.
This masterpiece will confirm to anyone outside of Germany that they’re not joking: Alexander Marcus - Hawaii Toast Song
You forgot the Spam.
Loosely covered under "pork?"
I’d visit China before I visited the US right now.
They might have booked the trip before it was clear it was going to be so bad, and I doubt you can get your money back on a ticket for something like that. They probably rolled the dice and hoped for the best. It’s always been a roulette of whether you’d get a ‘good’ border patrol agent or some guy with a chip on his shoulder. It’s just that the latter feels more empowered now and there’s nobody keeping them in check.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/travel/news/2025/04/21/german-tourists-turned-away-us-border/83195396007/
Provided that that's true, and I'm not saying it definitely is, that would be a valid reason to deny entry.
I agree, but you can imagine that when you have young adults in a room for hours, you can guide them toward those answers as well. When I was younger, I would book tickets to travel and explore the world without any idea of what the next day would bring. You can see how discussions can lead to questions like, “So, in five weeks, will you work if you don’t have a hostel?” and the response being, “Oh yeah, why not?” I’m not suggesting that the young person didn’t plan for this, but considering they were coming from Thailand and New Zealand…
In case you missed that part.
I hear you. 👌
I would bet it was for a WWOOFing or Workaway style thing where you do a few hours menial labor in exchange for room and board. Often attracts backpacker types. Typical advice is to lie to Customs (in any country) and just get a tourist visa, which is always a gamble at best.
That’s what I was thinking too. And afaik that’s just legal.
I think we’re pretty well past giving the gestapo the benefit of the doubt.
This really doesn’t seem like something the administration has a hand in.
When you travel internationally and land the first thing that happens is you fill out a slip go through immigration. The slip asks how long you are staying and where your are staying among other things.
Not accounting for your accommodations for the full duration of your trip will get you flagged for more questions. If the immigration officer things you are going to work during your stay they will deny you because it’s illegal on a tourist visa.
What the girls should have done was just say they were staying at the hotel for the whole time (although 5 weeks at a hotel is probably also a red flag)
What an amazing coincidence that since the change in administrations there have been multiple horror stories about CBP detaining tourists at the slightest suspicion they might do housework or some undetermined gig work during a 3 week stay. Trying to pretend this is just how it always worked is naive in the extreme.
It always worked this way just wasn’t worthy news. Ever watched boarder patrol this kind of shit happened all the time. Helping your friend do house work is considered work when staying in another country.
On the one hand, I don’t doubt it’s gotten worse. On the other hand, I’ve always heard stories about US immigrations being unreasonable, entirely humourless, and possibly detaing you or sending you back for the smallest mistake or omission.
I’ve never once heard about German teenagers being strip searched because they had a bad answer about whether they would do any work during their vacation.
Multiple horror stories is the weakest data set you can come up with.
How many tourists do you think come through the US in a single day? What percentage does “multiple” cases make up?
Yes, it is how its always worked that if you go through immigration and you get flagged for something suspicious you get detained for further questioning. Did you expect the immigration officer to let you through if you failed the initial set of questions like "where will you be staying for the duration of your trip? "
Let me throw this back at you for a sec. How exactly do you are the Trump administration organizing this? Did they suddenly hire a bunch of new immigration officers? Among the hiring and spending freeze and stupid Doge stuff, where did these new officers come from? Do the officers now have some detained quota they need to meet each day? Are all TSA secretly MAGA waiting for the chance to deny tourists?
Sometimes the simplest explanation is right in front of you. The girls were too truthful on their form and that for them flagged and detained. You need to account for where you will be while in the US ( or most countries honestly). Otherwise it is assumed you might do something like try to work and stay long term beyond your visa. When their answers didn’t add up they got sent home.
If you don’t believe this go ahead and try and travel to any country and tell them you don’t have a place to stay yet, don’t know when you will leave exactly, but you’ll just wing it. See if that flies.
You really are shockingly naive. Yes, CBP officers are assholes dispositionally eager to treat non-Americans harshly and changes in administration do change policy, both explicitly and implicitly. Like their comrades in ICE, they’ve been itching to “get tough” the whole time.
Do you seriously think German teenagers were regularly getting strip searched for muddled responses to whether they would do any work and it was just for some reason not reported on prior to a couple months ago?
The administration has set the tone of "Fuck with people as much as you want. Lie if you want to. There will be no consequences."
I've said "I might answer some emails" at the EU border before, and the agent just shook her head and was like "try again, business or pleasure?"
This particular rule has been loosely enforced in post COVID times and people just need to re learn how to cross borders.
Apart from work trips, I can’t think of the last time I had accommodation all booked. I don’t really see the point of travelling if you don’t make plans after being there a while and getting to know good info from locals. A lot of the time locations or weather just sucks, so I keep on and adventure somewhere else instead. That’s kind of normal outside of resort holidaying.
Right here officer this post. This guy is sus.
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/pictrs/image/cd06c54d-0edf-4c22-b895-fe1e3eb0c9d1.webp">
I wonder what passport people like you hold? This sounds like passport privilege. Those with “good” passports get to travel where they want without a thought.
There are many countries where they scrutinise where you’re going to be staying and how you’re going to pay. You can’t apply for any visa without giving proof of accommodation bookings and showing bank statements.
I’ve been to America before Trump and there were plenty of questions at the border about where I was going and to see my confirmed hotel bookings, and I went with a “good” passport (UK) at the Canadian border.
Not everyone has the money you have to be able to all of that.
Assumptions will rarely end up in your favour.
You perhaps didn’t read they were teen backpackers? Of all the travellers in the world, find me a majority in the financial position to book all their accommodation with the confidence that no matter what, it’s going to be great because that’s the assurance of such a travel style and the price tag it comes with.
It’s not like you’re going to find the best deals online in a place with a hundred places to stay. Or maybe you can and that’s the irony of your assumption.
I was talking about you. That’s why i used the word “you” in my comment replying to you.
Yes, I’m not sure why you think that wasn’t clear. Fills me with doubt that you grasped much else of my comment. Oh, well.
Are you daft? Lmao
Well I’m clearly not capable of your levels of communication and unfortunately haven’t been for some time.
I foolishly thought of people’s real world experiences to explain a reality, when all you wanted was validation of your claim by—I dunno—an ATM receipt, or something… As I said, I am struggling to communicate on this level. I am so daft, you see.
Have a W-shaped cookie. You got me!
You mean hostel and Greyhound bus money as opposed to just hostel money for one place?
When they denying whiter than white German kids, shit done got real.
They need to come up with enough people to deport to justify their lies about the border.
Yes, this is border agents filling their quota.
Interestingly.as far as I’m aware
GermansItalians were one of the last “ethnicities” to be considered white, alongside the Irish.Edit: Originally said Germans, left the comment because it’s more about how whiteness is more about in group acceptance than actual skin tone.
If the Germans aren’t white, what the fuck is white?!
Generally it’s the people who you want to be. It’s not about “color”.
I’ve seen it described as “proximity to power”. Which is why the definition can change.
White is whatever the rich white guys say it is. It was never about skin color for them. It is about maintaining power, wealth, control, etc. Othering is like a hack to get people to do whatever they want.
You’re thinking of Italians. While some ‘german’ ethnicities were indeed swarthy whites along side Nordic countries in the 1700s, nearly all were included in the white umbrella by the start of the 1800s. Italians, Irish, and Mediterranean whites took well into the 20th century to be white.
Ah, my bad, I’ll update.
Don’t go in USA. There are planty other places in the world.
I completely believe these women, and I am sure Border Patrol invented sentences and put them in the transcript, altering what the women said in some parts and outright making stuff up in others. People assume transcripts are correct, but any corrupt authority can alter them or attribute anything to anyone. I called the Border Patrol to find out more and they surprisingly admittted to this corruption, saying “Yep, we alter transcripts all the time in between felching each other and praising Moloch.”
Having not fully booked your accommodation for the entire trip could get you denied entry to the US before Trump. Just saying. Especially if you aren’t white. Same with not having an outbound ticket.
yeah, it is not newsworthy when CBP does their normal, admittedly rather annoying job
of locking teens in detention centers
I'm sure it happens occasionally but I've never actually heard of CPB asking for hotel bookings, just outbound flight number. This is stuff you'd submit on a visa application. If the US wants to make Europeans get visa to travel then they should just do that.
They have asked for both and in one case they have asked for bank statement. This happens very often to citizens of third world country. We just knew what to carry with us all the time and no issue.
This. It also gets you denied in Australia and other countries. This is non-news.
Source: Previously my guilty pleasure was watching Border Security Australia Not so much anymore.
Is it that common? How do they handle backpackers?
I’ve literally never gone on a single multi-week vacation in my entire life with fully booked accommodation for the whole thing. I book the majority of the first week and I know when I’m flying back, but in between I’m mostly guided by the wind.
I can’t book hotels in places I don’t know I’ll be going.
How do people get multi week vacations?
Double income, single household, no kids. (and even then just barely, i will add)
Or, if you’re talking time wise, live in a country that isn’t run by and for corporations and you can still enjoy some paid time off.
Just book some of your +5 weeks per year together. What, are you American or something?
A few years back my 19 yo American son had a great experience working the summer as a camp counselor here in the states. It is a religious camp (not that my son is that religion) that draws in campers from the states and Europe. Many of those campers as they get older come back as counselors. They get the appropriate visas, make money working the camp for 8 weeks, then take the few weeks after camp before they have to leave and blow that money on traveling the States and their trip home. It was an incredible experience and inspired my son to bust his ass, save money, and a few years later took a self funded trip to Europe where he couch surfed these homes of the friends he made.
I think about those kids this year. There’s no way I’d risk traveling back to this shit hole country if I were them.
You get a minimum of 24 days paid vacation in Germany. Up 28 days are common.
When I started my last job (big multinational corporation) after an internship, I got 3 weeks of paid vacation right off the bat, with 1 more week every few years, up to a maximum of 7 weeks.
Plus 1 more week if I chose to "buy" a week by estimating the vacation I would accrue throughout the remainder of the year and subtracting 1 week's pay from that.
I doubt it’s common. I’ve traveled to Australia and the US (and a bunch of other places) with just a few nights in a hostel booked, sometimes even without a return flight. Might be different if you’ve got a middle eastern name or something like that, but pretty much every backpacker travels this way.
Imagine booking 2 years ahead when you’re on a writing holiday visa, that’s just nuts.
It’s not the only thing. It’s a combination of limited/no living accommodations and no income. If you don’t have the income to stay for 5 weeks for example, they will send you back.I’m talking like going to Australia or US with just $500 or something for 5 weeks. I can cite some episodes when I get off work today and you can see the process.
But, people haven’t been bringing money with them for decades now. They use payment cards.
But overall CBP looks at funds. If someone can’t afford their stay, they become suspicious.
EDIT: Adding, they ask how much people intend to spend or call banks to verify
I don’t think it is common. I just know it happens.
The process looks like this..
Sort of a good example because it happens to be a traveler going into the United States for vacation, 5 weeks, 1.5k cash, but still denied entry. They always ask for purpose of entry, what itinery looks like, funds, etc.
There’s tons of backpackers, as a one bagger myself, I’ve never had trouble. I think its when you may have limited/no accommodations plus other factors: stories not lining up, limited funds, no/limited knowledge of itinerary, etc. That gets people in trouble. I think most people know where they are going, what for, and how they are going to do it.
Even as a US citizen I’m happy I’m not traveling internationally for a while though. Seems most people are free game regardless to CBP, citizen or not 🤮
Denied entry is far different than being strip searched and locked up in a jail with serious criminals.
I was responding to the original comment above : “Having not fully booked your accommodation for the entire trip could get you denied entry to the US before Trump. Just saying. Especially if you aren’t white. Same with not having an outbound ticket.”
Not to the strip searching, abuse, etc.
I agree it is absolutely heinous what is happening in the US and I wouldnt travel here either but the process of denying entry for a combination of limited/no accommodations, limited funds, varying answers, etc does lead to denial of entry in some countries.
I met a good chunk of Europeans and Aussies while thru hiking on the AT a few years ago.
All of those folks did not have full accommodations booked in advance, that would have been impossible. They seemed to find that pretty normal and were not turned away.
Where you intend to stay is part of the questioning when you enter and they can get quite suspicious if you don’t have a plan. Source: An Austrian, white friend of mine who went to the US. He also just wanted to travel around but was warned in advance (by other, mostly white europeans) that he shouldn’t state that when asked. It’s just not worth the risk.
While that’s not the same as having to show hotel bookings for the whole stay, it is a thing travelers have had to worry about for quite some time now. I’m sure it’s worse and more complicated for anyone of color.
Not allowed to go camping unless you’re a citizen I guess
Likely they did not have enough fund to stay in Hawaii that long. It becomes a liability.
So we just making shit up to make it make sense now?
Well do u know the tourist and their finance to support themselves? U know they can probably go to places like Goa, Sri Lanka. Cheaper imo
With this administration, the most likely thing is another fuckup.
You just call daddy and get another thousand on your account. This is not hard.
“We wanted to travel spontaneously.”
This is how my sister and I do our road trips. We get in the car and drive until we are tired then search for a hotel. If we find a town we like we might stop there even if the day is young.
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.dbzer0.com/pictrs/image/20f4c152-722a-4df6-9bce-a3dfad2ffaf6.webp">
On bike? Believe it or not, also jail.
Yeah, I’ve always travelled like this. You just get a ho(s)tel for the first few nights, and then you just stay longer if you like where you are or you move on to the next place based on what locals/other travellers recommend.
Criminal scum
lol, that's how I did my trip to Germany. I got my first hotel for only a few days, then decided when/where to go next based on that. Rinse-Repeat for a few weeks
Why would anybody travel to that shithole country?
Because people booked last year and can’t get a refund.
Is losing your non-refundable booking a worse outcome than a few nights in a detention cell?
To anyone who was paying attention this was already a pretty clear possibility last year. Not to mention that all the people voting for this outcome also make it an unpleasant place to visit on a more personal level, even if the election had gone the other way.
You have to understand that there are people who have better things to do with their time than keep up with foreign politics or arrange their lives around it. You could just say nothing and not shit on people who don’t want to lose a thousand dollars because a nation decided to have shit for heads this season.
Well, then they have to face the consequences of not paying attention to the things happening in the place they intend to go to
Like, yeah, ideally you wouldn’t need to worry about this, but this is always a risk when traveling, and politics has that trait of being interested in you whether or not you are interested in it back
People who travel to shitholes like the US for several weeks at the time clearly don’t have “better things to do with their time”.
Ah yeah, that’s fair.
I guess they learned their lesson.
I think it is sad, I would really like to travel in the USA as I think the nature and the culture are really interesting. But for my entire adult life the USA actually would have been a gamble to travel to.
The laws around entry to the country are also really weird, as the immigration officer that checks your visa has the ultimate authority of whether you are allowed entry. There are no concrete laws that limit their say over this.
The most shocking thing about this is the five weeks. Like as Americans we have no clue how the rest of the world lives. The entire country of France stops working for 6 weeks in the summer. And we fight to get 2 weeks if we’re lucky.
Pretty easy to take off 5 weeks when you are unemployed.
The French get 25 days off per year, which is on the higher side in Europe, but not quite 6 weeks.
Don’t understand why you’re being downvoted. Because you’re exactly right. They just finished school and very likely don’t have a job. Very likely they are going to want to study later on and are spendig their time between the final school exams in spring and the start of the winter semester at university travelling, as man young Germans do.
Vacation time in Europe is a lot better than the US, but this has nothing to do with it. Depending on your contract you could get 30 days off in Germany, and since you don’t have to count the weekends or state holidays, if you work a regular Mo-Fr work week, you can arrange for a 6 week trip, but they had already spent 5 weeks in Thailand and NZ, were planning 5 weeks in Hawaii and then keep going other places. The way they are travelling is out of reach for most employees in Germany and it’s a once in a lifetime opportunity for many.
Heavily depends on whether you’re backpacking and staying at hostels or expecting all the usual vacation bells and whistles. But yes unless you become a digital nomad it’s not sustainable into adulthood, this is probably a gap year kind of thing. Saving up a couple of thousand working while in secondary education while still living with parents can get you quite a ways.
Also, there’s still tradespeople going on journey, with actual work visas. Tough luck doing such a thing abroad without a guild with the right contacts into state structures, staying within the EU is significantly easier.
I’m not trying to be mean, but the difference between 10 days and 25 days is the difference between night and day.
You successfully failed to be mean.
Why so many downvotes for this guy? I don’t understand. As a student I could easily do some courses next year and take time to travel. Even better when you’ve just finished studying and go travel before starting a job. It’s not that weird, right?
I think maybe the phrasing? Calling them unemployed might have bad implications, even though it is accurate for recent graduates. I’m not sure.
Really I just find it interesting. Lemmy works in mysterious ways sometimes :D
Does the 25 days include national holidays like Xmas, etc? Perhaps it’s more than 25 once the national holidays are factored in?
Nope, those are all added on top.
Same as here in the UK. It’s depressing hearing how bad people in the US and some other countries have it. Although there is always room for improvement on 25 days!
25 days off per year MINIMUM required by law. At least that’s how it works in Sweden. Very common to have extra vacation days as a benefit. Then add the “red days” like first of may (international workers day, also outdoor fucking day according to some). There are 13 of them this year so minimum 38 days off. Americans were just too stupid to fight for it.
Does the state supply someone to fuck whilst outside?
No, you’d have to go to the netherlands for that.
I’m from the UK and also have 25 days of paid leave with national holidays on top, totalling 32 days this year. I’m going to use 6 of them so I get the two weeks around Christmas off.
I’m a middle aged American and have never had a paid vacation.
I feel solidarity for you. My dad was a self employed mechanic, and the only vacation he ever took was when he broke his leg.
It’s not the entire country that stops working but there’s indeed a significant reduction. If you don’t have children you’d have to be crazy to take time off work during the school holidays in summer (and also like the heat if you’re going somewhere in France because nowhere has mild temperatures anymore).
The legal minimum for full time jobs is 5 weeks but most people have more since they have jobs where you get extra rest time since you work more than 35h/week. Some affluent French people go skiing 2-3 times a year for a week or two each time and then also take two weeks off in summer, all paid.
I used to have 56 paid days off (that’s 11 weeks because Saturday and Sunday didn’t count) each year because I worked a lot more than the legally mandated hours and I had advantageous time credit for showing up early and leaving late and 4 days extra because I never took time off during school holidays (incentive to keep the shifts fully staffed). The pay was shit but at least I could go on trips all the time. I did end up getting a lot of those days paid instead because I didn’t have enough money to travel all the time and I couldn’t be bothered to stay home.
With this much time off our productivity was still very good, everything was timed and we always went above 100% of targets and long-term projects always done early.
Blue collar work in the USA looks like a scam in comparison: working the same job I would have had less purchasing power (sure the numbers entering your bank account are higher, but the health insurance alone cancels it out), more working hours and a lot less paid leave.
I really want to know what changed that made the above happen much more often.
In December, if Customs had concerns about two teenagers trying to sneak into the US to work on a travel visa, where did they go? How was it handled? Because it feels like overkill and probably much more expensive than what we used to do.
Why are we sending backpacking teenagers with visa concerns to the same place as a murderer?
Why are they being strip searched like they were drug smugglers?
And then this feels like the after-the-fact coverup. Whatever they held them on was super flimsy, so they tried to make it sound worse when they realized this was going to hit the news.
The news decided to pay attention, that’s what changed, not the reality.
I mean yeah for non-white people maybe. But teenage German girls, that’s a novum
I’m not American, so, it’s easy for me to call horseshit on that one.
Per that last bit, I’m guessing they never had a lawyer present. Would make any of those fabricated statements null and void, if the constitution meant anything.
This is pretty standard treatment. There are only a limited number of holding cells in an airport, moslty for men.
If there is no returning flight that day they are sent to a local jail (known as a remand centre outside of the US) and stripping and searching is standard at those places.
The women said that they were going to do work in the US.
The women said “They twisted it to make it seem as if we admitted that we wanted to work illegally in the US.”
This has been happening for a long time. It’s just that they are from first world country. Welcome to how it feels to be from a third world country. Not only US but I have been stopped at Munich and Frankfurt airport and thoroughly scanned and document checked while everyone just walk through security.
I’m from Canada and had to explain to border officers what my accommodations and means of personal support would be for a two week stay in the US. I was almost denied entry because I wasn’t carrying sufficient cash on hand.
That was almost twenty years ago.
I don’t know the full context of your situation, but sometimes it’s easy to fall into the mindset of always feeling like a victim. I’ve seen people of all backgrounds get scanned or checked at airports. Have you considered if there might have been a specific reason you were stopped?
Personally, I’ve been stopped several times too, and in some cases, I later realized it was due to something simple, like forgetting to take keys out of my pockets, which triggered the sensors.
I just wrapped up my 46th country. Happened to me everytime and to most of the people coming from SEA and northern Africa.
I think you are really exaggerating there. It doesn’t happen for all people coming from SEA or northern Africa. You don’t see all the people from SEA or north Africa being pulled and scanned every time.
I don’t know for the US but clearly not in Europe. You really need to think about why you always getting scanned.
I have read somewhere that someone is always scanned at the airport because they were in the S database of France.
Very very normal for anyone flying to first world country from a third world country and you are person of color. I recommend u go see the pyramid, fly back on Egypt air to Frankfurt. You will see in person.
You’re comparing between different sample pools, which matters when we’re talking about probability adjacent stuff. We’re not asking “from this large pool of people at an airport, who is likely to receive additional scrutiny?” Because of this, your comment about how you’ve seen people of all backgrounds get scanned isn’t relevant to OP’s point.
The scope we’re looking at is the pool of experiences across one person’s trips. Imagine if it was every time that you got stopped for additional checks at an airport, even when you couldn’t see any mistakes that you had made. If you get checked because your keys triggered the sensors, then that’s a mistake that you can learn from, but consider how it would feel if you meticulously complied with everything you were meant to do, but were still consistently pulled aside for additional checks.
I know that on the internet, you never know whether someone is being hyperbolic, or straight up spinning a yarn, but try to take OP on faith here and consider how dismissive your comment comes across. I don’t know OP’s particular circumstances, but I have previously made a comment similar to yours to a friend, who called me out on being an asshole. Back then, I was oblivious to the reality of these things.
My friend explained that the first time they were pulled aside for additional checks, they opted to believe that it was just a random thing. The second time, they felt more uneasy, but actively resisted the “victim mentality” (their words). By the 20th time, they had come to expect it as inevitable, and that no change to how they packed, or what they wore would change things. They desperately wanted to believe that they weren’t being targeted for additional searches, but after a certain point, it becomes impossible to believe that these things are random.
Like I said, I don’t know the full context of OP’s situation—I just wanted to offer another possible explanation, which may or may not apply to them.
I’ve come across similar comments from people who are convinced they’re facing discrimination, but when you take a closer look at the facts, it’s not always so clear-cut. For example, I once saw someone say they always get rejected from jobs, often instantly, and were certain it was because of the photo on their résumé. But when you actually read their CV and look at the roles they applied for, it turned out they didn’t meet any of the listed requirements. Having two years of bootcamp experience won’t typically land you a role at a startup asking for four years in a specific tech stack.
If you always assume you’re a victim, it can prevent you from growing and might lead you to overlook areas where you could improve.
Again, I’m not denying that discrimination exists or saying OP is imagining things—I just think it’s important to consider all angles.
You’re considering all angles except the one the op is telling you that they experienced.
OK lol. Stay like that.
You don’t have any experience youngin, so don’t offer your opinion. It’s useless at best, and arrogant at worst.
How you come up with I don’t have experience? Because I just didn’t agree with what you say?
Because you didn’t offer any. You didn’t offer any cuz you don’t.
Now sit down, this isn’t debate class
Yes, exactly what I said. You are only searching for answers from people that agree with you. I gave already examples but OK continue play the victim and I am sure that you will one day find happiness.
Ahh. i hope you gave a long memory and the capacity to learn shame, cuz this is a bad look that a future-you should remember and cringe at.
save these, ok?
You’re saying you’ve been arrested, handcuffed, strip searched, sent to jail and then deported – and that’s been happening for a long time?
The people just walking were checked at departure and are local citizens.
They’re lucky they were sent home instead of to an El Salvador concentration camp.
They were the right color of skin.
It likely saved them, but being white still doesn’t guarantee your safety from the US gulags.
are you implying that fascists might not be reliable?
I’ve been seeing a lot of reports lately of white people getting screwed over like this. They all had one thing in common: women traveling without male company.
Travel advice to USA has pretty much always been to have your destination/hotel at hand for customs and your tickets for the flight back. They were also interested in how you would get to said destination, so better have a car rented in advance.
It was so silly when the immigration officer asked me (at the origin, not the destination because they want to avoid to fly you back): “And what if John won’t be there to pick you up at the airport?” Me: “I don’t know man, take an Uber?”
Turns out it never was a free country at all
In addition, don’t say anything that suggests you will work, even if unpaid. Don’t mention volunteering, helping a friend, doing remote work, etc. The rules are quite specific about what visas allow and do not allow, and many border people are just there to catch a paycheck - they will absolutely err on the side of denial. It is not a fair game, and you will not be given a fair chance to explain yourself.
Oh no! This dastardly Europeans wanted to come here and work! How dare they! Deport them!
This country was cooked a long time ago.
From another story about the event, it wasn’t even like odd jobs for a host, it was small job remote work for people in Germany and Asia. Stuff they would be doing at home and just kept doing during downtime on a long vacation.
Don’t reply to any business emails while lounging by the pool, you need a work visa for that!
They should find someone local and pay them to respond to the emails.
This is a much, much better article. I’m surprised at the NYPost’s shoddy quality (though I don’t know much about them); the headline especially feels misleading. Thanks for sharing a better source.
The NYPost is a crappy conservative tabloid. I don’t know why people keep posting stories from it.
Why go to US, Germany is far more wonderful
Germany is not tropical.
How about France ?
*yet
I saw this in an episode of border patrol Canada when a guy was coming to help his friend in Canada do yard work\landscaping. The officers said he was trying to take a Canadian job, work illegally, and was barred from entering the country.
My buddy had the same deal going into the US. Was going to take a month off and visit and while there was going to help reno his backyard. Just lifting and hammering. Another body.
Customs said literally the exact same thing to him (he was taking a job from an American) and said he could not allow entry. He tried to make it happen a year later and customs grilled him but let him enter that time.
A relative of mine just had a baby, and her mom came from out-of country to meet her grandchild and help mom and dad in those first crazy weeks with a newborn.
But when she told CBP that she was “coming to help her daughter with the new baby” she got detailed and questioned for 2 hours. Eventually they let her through but they were really trying to pin her coming to work illegally on a tourism visa.
If you or a loved one are in a similar situation, just say you’re “visiting family”. Apparently it’s a legal gray area in this shithole to help your child take care of a newborn.
No fucking shit she got attention. This is a classic “comes in and never leaves” scenario border patrols are well aware of.
That makes no sense. A person could just as easily say they are going to Disney, while secretly planning on never leaving.
Every time I’ve been to Cuba I show up in the airport and basically have a car rented, maybe first night in a hotel. Then we drive wherever we feel like and usually pick up a hitchhiker or two that will have a “sister” that has a room for rent.
It has almost always been clean, friendly, cheap, and a good breakfast. Rinse, repeat. I love travelling like this and have generally done this everywhere I’ve gone in the third world. Apparently the US doesn’t even measure up to third world.
What is the sensationalist crap? They admitted they intended to work, probably talked too fucking much. I mean for chrissakes they even told the reporter they intend to work in another foreign country soon.
Yes. Teenage girls not keeping their traps shut, even in front of immigration SOBs seems to be the most likely thing, here.
No shit, right? The writer isn’t nearly good enough to disguise that.
What does working in a different country have to do with the US? They said they didn’t want to work in the US and that CBP falsified their testimony. As they themselves admitted it was just naiv to believe germans were excempt from the administrations pullshit.
And you believe that? Your bullshit detector broken or what?
Since when Costa Rica is in the US?
Since when is your common sense determined by rage bait articles?
I mean, assuming any of that is true,; fine. Deny them entry and send them back home. Why are they strip searching then and throwing them behind bars?
You must have just learns what happens at non land international borders involving non citizens denied entry after January of this year.
When the world thinks “illegal immigration” we all think “Germans sneaking into Hawaii”.
They finally found the culprit for the shit state of the United State: It’s all those pesky german young adults backpacking through the world and visiting Hawaii for like a few weeks or something!
At least they weren’t detained.
I see you didn’t read the article which describes the detention in depth?
Spoiler: they were detained.
“We were searched with metal detectors, our entire bodies were scanned, and we had to stand naked in front of the police officers and were looked through,” Pohl said. “Then we were given green prison clothes and put in a prison cell with serious criminals.”
Look at those evil immigrants. No doubt they’ll… they’ll… hold on, can we use some AI to replace the stock photo with brown people? Thank you.
NGL, traveling to America right now is just too risky. Don’t do it, for your own safety.
I know every country has its problems and that there are desperate people everywhere.
but its very much american exceptionalism, that americans would assume people coming from a country that has infinitely more worker rights, would move to their failing state just to work.
If the US stop bombing and middling in South America, and countries in the middle east, most of these people will voluntary go back or never try to get into the states in the first place.
not the only ones spreading death and displacement,
Russia, Turkey, Israel, and Saudi Arabia to name a few of the worst offenders
I travelled a lot and never pre booked more than the first night
They just plain don’t even want the tourism money
Holy shit the comments on that article. I know NY Post leans right, but some of them got their noses so far up Trump’s ass they’re snorting small intestine
Oh the horror! Not hard working people working for USA!