‘We are not subordinate’: Claudia Sheinbaum warns U.S. against drone-bombing Mexico (globalnews.ca)
from RandAlThor@lemmy.ca to world@lemmy.world on 09 Apr 23:18
https://lemmy.ca/post/42046517

#world

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CobraChicken3000@lemmy.ca on 10 Apr 00:05 next collapse

That’s fucking wild! Mexico is not South Sudan or Afghanistan, failed states ruled by warlords. It will start with “we’re only targetting cartels” and conclude with “these terrorists are purposely using hospital staff as human shields, what would you have us do?!”

AverageGoob@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 00:07 next collapse

Wild take here but I don’t really think the US should be bombing ANY other nation.

CobraChicken3000@lemmy.ca on 10 Apr 00:08 next collapse

Haha I respect that

catloaf@lemm.ee on 10 Apr 00:10 next collapse

Not even Israeli or Russian troops in Palestine or Ukraine?

iz_ok@sh.itjust.works on 10 Apr 00:20 next collapse

Correct. The US should stick to the tried and true method of supplying the weapons, teaching users how to maximize their effectiveness, and assist in the logistics of the altercations.

entwine413@lemm.ee on 10 Apr 01:08 collapse

Or just stop sticking our nose into everyone else’s business.

lolcatnip@reddthat.com on 11 Apr 15:07 collapse

Into Russia’s business? Because assisting Ukraine is not “sticking our nose in” their business any more than the fire department is sticking their nose in your business when you call to report a fire.

jonne@infosec.pub on 10 Apr 01:12 collapse

The US could just stop sending weapons to Israel and the fighting will stop too. As for Ukraine, Zelensky has tried to make deals with Russia before and the West told him not to because they promised they’d continue backing him with more weapons that would give them the edge, which the US is obviously reneging on now (which, to be fair, is something Trump sort of said he’d do, so you could argue that’s been democratically decided).

gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works on 10 Apr 02:23 collapse

Agreed on Israel, but you are WILDLY misrepresenting the context and tenor of the Ukrainian war.

jonne@infosec.pub on 10 Apr 02:51 collapse

www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2022/05/5/7344206/

They were close to a deal during a relative high water mark (Ukraine had just taken Kharkiv back and a huge chunk of the east). They’ve only gone backwards since and whatever deal they can get now will most likely be worse.

gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works on 10 Apr 02:59 next collapse

They were not close to a deal. Putin’s desired endgame is “I own Ukraine”. Ukraine’s desired endgame is “Ukraine continues to exist and isn’t constantly hammered by Russian missiles and bombs”. There’s not really much room for negotiation there. Moreover, Putin has negotiated in demonstrably bad faith multiple times over the course of the war (and I mean since 2014, when they used unmarked soldiers to annex parts of Ukraine and “held a referendum”). I’m not claiming Ukraine is a flawless paragon of virtue, but at the same time, there are VERY clear good guys and bad guys in the Ukrainian government war. Russia is the bad guys.

jonne@infosec.pub on 10 Apr 03:14 collapse

I didn’t ever say the Russians were the good guys. I’m saying the West is happy to keep Ukrainians fighting and dying for geopolitical reasons. Zelensky was elected on a platform of making a deal and ending the war, and he wasn’t allowed to do that by the West.

Eventually there will be a peace, and even though it would be fair that Ukraine gets all its territory back, realistically that’s not going to happen (and if it did, there’s the question of what happens to all the Russian speakers in those areas). The deal he could’ve gotten right after the failed Russian invasion would’ve been better than whatever he can get now, especially with Trump now basically being in Putin’s side.

It’s just a case of the US continuing to push too far thinking you can just beat Russia with better technology, even though history has shown that Russian leaders are perfectly happy to just throw men into the battle until the enemy runs out of ammo.

lolcatnip@reddthat.com on 10 Apr 03:22 collapse

Do you believe Ukrainians have no agency? Nobody but Russia is forcing them to fight.

jonne@infosec.pub on 10 Apr 04:33 collapse

They have, but they were promised the backing of the US, and now they’re not going to have it any more.

themaninblack@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 04:03 collapse

Cool source bro

I was wrong, this is independent of Pravda in Russia. My bad.

jonne@infosec.pub on 10 Apr 04:35 collapse

So a Ukrainian news paper isn’t good enough? I can find other sources for the same story if you like. Or you can search for stories that explore the background of Johnson’s sudden Kyiv trip yourself.

idiomaddict@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 04:53 next collapse

Pravdas Ukrainian now? en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pravda

jonne@infosec.pub on 10 Apr 05:03 collapse

Not to be confused with Prada, Pravda.ru, Komsomolskaya Pravda, Ukrainska Pravda, pravda DE, pravda EN, pravda ES, pravda FR, or pravda PL.

Come on man, at least read the links you post.

idiomaddict@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 05:14 collapse

Jesus, why did they choose that name? I get that it means truth, but surely it was tainted by the then 88 year old newspaper in the country that colonized yours? Imagine if an Algerian person, fed up with French interference in their media, founded the Algerian newspaper, Le Monde.

lolcatnip@reddthat.com on 11 Apr 15:03 collapse

Seeing how popular the name is, I suspect it’s just a very generic newspaper name, like how a lot of English-language newspapers have Times in their names. For example, India has The Times of India and The Hindustan Times, despite the name coming from a former colonizer.

idiomaddict@lemmy.world on 11 Apr 17:02 collapse

I can understand that, but I suspect that neither calls itself The Times. In countries with a large newspaper known as a Times, The Times is called The London Times to differentiate itself

themaninblack@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 05:21 collapse

Shit, my bad dude. You’re right, it’s independent of Pravda in Russia.

www.bostonglobe.com/2022/04/…/story-their-lives/

Embargo@lemm.ee on 10 Apr 00:31 collapse

Whoa! Calm down!

ogmios@sh.itjust.works on 10 Apr 00:14 next collapse

failed states ruled by warlords

Do you have any idea how many candidates get murdered in elections in Mexico?

CobraChicken3000@lemmy.ca on 10 Apr 00:25 collapse

Or Russia?

ogmios@sh.itjust.works on 10 Apr 00:40 next collapse

Weird non-sequitur, but okay.

CobraChicken3000@lemmy.ca on 10 Apr 00:48 collapse

Perhaps I misunderstood what you meant, but my point is that there are other countries that have similar issues to Mexico, but we don’t bomb them.

ogmios@sh.itjust.works on 10 Apr 00:56 next collapse

Russia doesn’t share a border with your country, while being home to a number of brutal cartels run by ex US military special forces.

Also, we are literally bombing Russia by proxy right now.

jonne@infosec.pub on 10 Apr 01:13 collapse

Russia has nuclear weapons, which is the main reason.

Mihies@programming.dev on 10 Apr 05:46 collapse

And Putin is a great person and Orange’s friend according to Orange.

jonne@infosec.pub on 10 Apr 06:06 collapse

Biden didn’t bomb Russia either, this is a bipartisan policy.

Mihies@programming.dev on 10 Apr 06:35 collapse

Of course you can’t just bomb Russia. I’m merely saying that the Orange has further incentives.

glitch1985@lemmy.world on 11 Apr 04:54 collapse

Nobody gets murdered in Russia. They just accidentally fall out of windows because they’re clumsy.

NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io on 10 Apr 02:31 next collapse

Mexico is not South Sudan or Afghanistan, failed states ruled by warlords

I'll note that for the latter, it's a failed state ruled by warlords because the US rolled in and fucked everything up.

CobraChicken3000@lemmy.ca on 10 Apr 05:05 next collapse

But Taliban was in power before the 2001 invasion.

NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io on 10 Apr 05:10 next collapse

Okay, and? Like them or hate them (jk you should hate them) but they had a state; it wasn't "a failed state ruled by warlords".

CobraChicken3000@lemmy.ca on 10 Apr 05:15 collapse

That’s debatable

NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io on 10 Apr 05:24 collapse

No it's not? A failed state is one in which the state can't punish a significant amount of non-state sanctioned violence, which wasn't the case in Afghanistan.

FarceOfWill@infosec.pub on 10 Apr 10:09 collapse

I suppose if you use that definition then when America invaded it became a failed state run by warlords and now it has recovered.

NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io on 10 Apr 11:44 collapse

Yeah exactly. Now, being a non-failed state, they can start the long, gruelling process of cultural and political evolution. That's why you're hearing about Afghani human rights activists now but not ten years ago.

aeshna_cyanea@lemm.ee on 10 Apr 05:58 collapse

“this film is dedicated to the brave mujahideen fighters of afghanistan”

Texas_Hangover@sh.itjust.works on 10 Apr 06:46 next collapse

Afghanistan was all fucked up long before that.

NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io on 10 Apr 06:47 next collapse

I mean it wasn't exactly a shining example of progress and order, but it wasn't a failed state.

EvilCartyen@feddit.dk on 10 Apr 06:49 collapse

Arguably, Afghanistan has never been united as a nation in the way we think about it, at least not for long. The cycle seems to be short decades of control under some power followed by decades of decentralization and local powers.

GreyEyedGhost@lemmy.ca on 10 Apr 15:03 next collapse

This statement is only relevant if your knowledge of history started in 1980.

NoneOfUrBusiness@fedia.io on 10 Apr 15:13 collapse

I mean given that the war on terror started in 2001, we don't need to go back any further than 1980.

GreyEyedGhost@lemmy.ca on 10 Apr 16:35 collapse

Well then, I guess it was perfect and stable prior to 2001, no need to investigate further!

ZK686@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 22:29 collapse

No, it’s a failed state because the cartels have more power than the government. Stop blaming your own country, traitor.

MonkderVierte@lemmy.ml on 10 Apr 12:41 next collapse

Israel a better example.

ZK686@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 22:28 next collapse

Scare tactics 101 by the left.

umbrella@lemmy.ml on 11 Apr 19:56 collapse

the only warlords governing afghanistan were the US.

dogerwaul@pawb.social on 10 Apr 00:54 next collapse

this is pure insanity lol holy shit. why is this being allowed to continue? i am beyond myself.

resipsaloquitur@lemm.ee on 10 Apr 02:13 next collapse

Anyone else getting tired of this guy?

Octopus_Man@lemm.ee on 10 Apr 04:53 next collapse

Yup.

Alloi@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 05:05 next collapse
  • a german citizen, 1940
Nalivai@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 22:18 next collapse

In 1935. By 1940 everyone who was able to say that was already not in a position to say anything. US is just at the beginning of the journey.

ZK686@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 22:27 collapse

Oh brother… here we go again…

douglasg14b@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 23:49 collapse

About 90 years later, yep. Here we go again…

Same suckers, different century.

ZK686@lemmy.world on 13 Apr 01:56 collapse

Let us know when you’re being sent to gas chambers…

ZK686@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 22:27 collapse

Here we go…

ZK686@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 22:27 collapse

Nope. Not the majority of us who voted for him.

resipsaloquitur@lemm.ee on 11 Apr 01:33 collapse

Not a majority. Maybe not even a plurality.

ZK686@lemmy.world on 13 Apr 01:52 collapse

Okay.

obinice@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 09:02 next collapse

Drone bombing? So, like, starting a war?

I’ll be interested to see how that pans out. Another powerful Dictator recently invaded a much smaller weaker nation, and that didn’t turn out how everyone expected, so…

ameancow@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 22:31 collapse

There are over 65 MILLION hispanic people in the US, many of them have family or other connections in Mexico.

If this clown started a war with fucking Mexico, it would end just like his “war with canada” with millions of people marching on DC and dragging his bloated, festering orange ass out of the white house with force and likely exacting their own justice out on the lawn. Americans have been wounded, but they still have limits.

Trump (or his team) know this, that’s why they’re saying all this shit, because they KNOW it riles up people who aren’t his supporters. They are deliberately trying to stoke division so that the Trump-haters and Trump-lovers go to war with each other. That is their ideal fantasy because it would allow martial law, revocation of rights, and like, five more terms of various Trump family members sitting on the throne.

Their trick is going to be riding the line long enough so that people tune out and stop caring about the lesser crimes he’s doing all day, every day.

mtmtchy@lemm.ee on 11 Apr 20:44 collapse

☝🏼☝🏼

IDKWhatUsernametoPutHereLolol@lemmy.dbzer0.com on 10 Apr 22:06 next collapse

Yes pls. Give Mexico, Canada, and the rest of the democratic world the reason to Liberate the US from tyranny.

ZK686@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 22:26 next collapse

Oh brother…

kent_eh@lemmy.ca on 10 Apr 22:52 next collapse

We’re a bit busy protecting ourselves from the US.

You Americans can fix your own damn problems.

IDKWhatUsernametoPutHereLolol@lemmy.dbzer0.com on 10 Apr 23:17 next collapse

How did you think the world protected themselves from fascism during WW2?

(Hint: Germans didn’t fix it by themselves.)

[deleted] on 11 Apr 05:29 next collapse
.
kent_eh@lemmy.ca on 11 Apr 14:33 next collapse

Hint: Germans didn’t fix it by themselves.

Of course, but the rest of the world didn’t take those actions until after the German military moved into several other countries. And that action was done in the defense of those other countries as much as it was to spank the Germans.

Nobody is coming to the US to save the US from itself. Things will have to get a helluva lot worse before that happens.

And it won’t be done to rescue the Americans, it will be intended to beat them into submission.

Plus, the rest of the world remembers that the Americans didn’t help us in WW2 until the war finally came to their shores, after the rest of us had been fighting for 3 years.

RowRowRowYourBot@sh.itjust.works on 11 Apr 19:58 collapse

Plus, the rest of the world remembers that the Americans didn’t help us in WW2 until the war finally came to their shores, after the rest of us had been fighting for 3 years.

You might be surprised to find out some parts of Asia were fighting even earlier than that.

RowRowRowYourBot@sh.itjust.works on 11 Apr 19:57 collapse

The USSR was doing most of the heavy lifting

ITguru@feddit.nl on 12 Apr 05:08 collapse

Yes by siding with the Germans

RowRowRowYourBot@sh.itjust.works on 11 Apr 19:56 collapse

Also any army invading the USA is going to face a lot of casualties. Why would other nations volunteer to die to fix America’s decline?

Pelicanen@sopuli.xyz on 11 Apr 05:12 next collapse

If I’m not mistaken, the US spends more on military than the rest of NATO combined. How do you imagine a military engagement against the US would end for us?

SomethingBurger@jlai.lu on 11 Apr 08:42 collapse

Poorly but the US would lose like the loser country they are. MFs couldn’t win against Vietnam or Afghan peasants.

Pelicanen@sopuli.xyz on 11 Apr 10:29 next collapse

It doesn’t quite feel right for other countries have to send their citizens to fight and die against a former ally just because American citizens can’t hold their government accountable.

RowRowRowYourBot@sh.itjust.works on 11 Apr 19:55 collapse

That’s because Americans could not stomach killing enough innocent people to win the war like we had in previous wars. The US military could have depopulated Afghanistan if the citizens of the US would have permitted it.

If an invading army is attacking America there’s little reason to believe the citizens wouldn’t be ok with killing every invader.

xor@lemmy.dbzer0.com on 11 Apr 20:18 collapse

depopulate is a pretty weird way to say “genocide”….

i, from my armchair, think it’s more about “hearts and minds”… as in, according to the us army guerilla warfare handbook, a guerilla army is impossible to defeat if they are well supported by the populace.

they can always disappear into someone’s home, and can always get new supplies….
well, unless you genocide the entire country….

RowRowRowYourBot@sh.itjust.works on 11 Apr 20:57 collapse

depopulate is a pretty weird way to say “genocide”….

Genocides suggest that people remain and/or suggests killing a single ethnic group. Depopulate means killing everyone. The choice of “depopulate” was intentional as I believe had the US military wanted to they had enough ordinance to kill literally everything in Afghanistan and Iraq.

theacharnian@lemmy.ca on 11 Apr 20:11 collapse

Sorry mate, that’s on you. Your founding padres even told you that unless you water your tree of liberty you might not keep your republic (paraphrasing Jefferson and Franklin here).

Randomgal@lemmy.ca on 11 Apr 20:32 collapse

These fuckers were supposedly accepting gunning down children every once in awhile because “guns are needed to resista tiranny”. Lmao.

ZK686@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 22:25 next collapse

I’d like to point out that we’re in this mess because Mexico doesn’t do enough to stop the cartels. No matter who Lemmy and Reddit spin it, the cartels are horrible organizations that commit horrible crimes.

stevedice@sh.itjust.works on 10 Apr 22:46 next collapse

I’d like to point out that we’re in this mess because the US doesn’t do enough to stop gun companies arming the cartels. No matter how Fox News and The Washington Post spin it, gun companies are horrible organizations that commit horrible crimes.

Disclaimer: this response is solely to point out that that ZK686 is a bumbling shortsighted idiot and in no way represents an endorsement of Claudia Sheinbaum who is an evil piece of shit.

courval@lemmy.world on 10 Apr 23:47 next collapse

Why is she a piece of shit?

stevedice@sh.itjust.works on 11 Apr 07:27 collapse

First of all, I didn’t say she was a piece of shit, I said she was an evil piece of shit. The evil part is very important. With that out of the way:

  1. She campaigned on the “no rich government with poor people” slogan and used it as justification to launch an “austerity plan” that cut funding to government programs, social welfare and infrastructure development while her appointed Secretary of Communications hired her own dad for a 12,000,000 MXN New Year’s show.
  2. Remember the austerity plan? She keeps around a makeup artist that charges 100,000 MXN a month while 60% of the country has to survive on less than 13,000 MXN.
  3. She proudly claims to have made the country safer because the number of homicides went down while willfully ignoring that the number of missing persons has been the highest it’s ever been for 2 years in a row.
  4. Sinaloa is currently in the middle of a war between two of the biggest cartels in the country. When asked how is she gonna deal with this, she replied “Guanajuato is worse”. Guanajuato is one of the few states that her party doesn’t control so this was definitely a calculated statement.
  5. When actually forced to make a statement about what the hell is she gonna do to protect the people of Sinaloa, she said “we’re working on it but violence is not the answer so we won’t send the army”.
  6. A month before she took office, the National Guard investigated a ranch suspected to have ties with the cartels and supposedly found nothing. Six months later, a civil collective made up of the families of cartel victims entered the ranch and found a literal extermination camp. She maintains nobody died in there.
  7. During her time as governor of Mexico City, one of the metro lines collapsed killing 23 people. She was quick to blame the previous governor and hired independent Norwegian contractor Det Norske Veritas (DNV) to carry out a forensic analysis to clean her name. They concluded that the line collapsed due to a lack of maintenance, so she promptly claimed DNV was colluding with her political opposition to undermine her government and threatened to sue if they released the results of the analysis.
  8. Wonder what happened to that previous governor she tried to blame for the collapse of the metro line? She appointed him as Secretary of Economy.
  9. While serving as “Jefa de Delegación” (sort of like a mayor) of Tlalpan, an elementary school collapsed during an earthquake killing 19 children. She claims to not have been aware of the irregularities in the construction but when the families of the victims tried to get a copy of the city records for the structural safety of the school, she provided a file that ended right before she was elected mayor and then proceeded to declare everything else as “classified”.
courval@lemmy.world on 11 Apr 09:07 collapse

Wtf an evil bitch in sheep’s makeup…

ZK686@lemmy.world on 13 Apr 01:50 collapse

Let us know when you’re leaving for better things!

stevedice@sh.itjust.works on 15 Apr 03:27 collapse

Well, this doesn’t make any sense. Then again, nothing you said does.

garbagebagel@lemmy.world on 11 Apr 01:15 next collapse

I’d like to point out that you’re in this mess because the US system has failed its citizens so badly that addiction is rampant and there is little to no social support for mental health or people experiencing poverty. Not to mention that your government provided those guns to the mexican cartels AND played a huge role in causing drug addiction in the US in the first place.

I have said it before and will say it again, the demand for drugs comes from WITHIN the US. Fix your social support systems and stay the fuck out of everyone else’s business.

mtmtchy@lemm.ee on 11 Apr 20:49 next collapse

Thank you. This seems like common sense.

ZK686@lemmy.world on 13 Apr 01:50 collapse

Let us know when you’re leaving…

MadBigote@lemmy.world on 11 Apr 05:35 next collapse

Does the US do enough to end it’s addiction to drugs?

ZK686@lemmy.world on 13 Apr 01:50 collapse

You cut the head of the snake to stop the poison… this is common sense.

admin@sh.itjust.works on 11 Apr 20:27 collapse

<img alt="" src="https://sh.itjust.works/pictrs/image/6917b7a1-682d-4f9f-8376-fa749284f8dc.jpeg">

ZK686@lemmy.world on 13 Apr 01:51 collapse

Bye.

admin@sh.itjust.works on 13 Apr 21:19 collapse
MetalMachine@feddit.nl on 11 Apr 05:57 next collapse

I mean… I’m sorry to say, but they are. Not what I want but how it is. The US has controlled and bullied its neighbors and South America for a while now.

kmaismith@lemm.ee on 11 Apr 14:47 collapse

I think you might be misinterpreting her words as descriptive rather than prescriptive. Mexico do declare they ain’t subordinate

Adderbox76@lemmy.ca on 11 Apr 14:43 next collapse

Trump thinks literally everyone is supposed to be subordinate to the U.S. because 'murica.

I say Mexico drone strikes the source of it’s gang’s weapons supply; namely the gun manufacturers in the United States.

digdilem@lemmy.ml on 11 Apr 14:53 collapse

subordinate to the U.S. because 'murica.

Not quite - he wants them to be subordinate to him.

In olden days, Kings would force fealty by forcing others to “kiss the ring”. That’s exactly what he tries to do - and what was behind the ridiculous display with his guest, President Zelensky.

We’ve seen him hide behind his title again and again when people challenge him “You don’t speak to the president like that!” Yet any small successes are entirely his doing. Shameful, if the man had any shame whatsoever.

Doctor_Satan@lemm.ee on 11 Apr 19:32 collapse

If you want to know how it came to be that Palestinians elected and supported Hamas, just watch in real time as Mexican cartels step up to help Mexico resist American imperialism. I guarantee it will play out in an eerily familiar way if Trump keeps playing these games.