It means Banksy, who has remained anonymous for more than 25 years, could finally be unmasked as he would be required to publicly disclose his name if brought to court.
Gonna be hard to bring them to court if you don’t even know their name, isn’t it?
With the London surveillance apparatus, I bet they could figure out who Banksy is. It’d be an insane waste of time and resources, but I bet they could.
KoboldCoterie@pawb.social
on 12 Sep 15:17
nextcollapse
The fact that they’re going to all this trouble over this image proves the point the image was making better than anything else possibly could have.
JoeKrogan@lemmy.world
on 12 Sep 15:21
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Exactly and the image is already out on the internet now.
Texas_Hangover@lemmy.radio
on 12 Sep 16:51
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i don’t think it’d be that many resources. that’s why they put up the surveillance in the first place. so its easy to find anyone and no one can easily hide.
AbouBenAdhem@lemmy.world
on 12 Sep 15:31
nextcollapse
Seems like an opportunity for a bunch of street artists to show up at court and pull an “I’m Spartacus”.
TachyonTele@piefed.social
on 12 Sep 18:21
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There's two companies associated with the name, at least. This is from memory, so grain of salt, but i believe there's a company specifically to get a hold of the artist(s). And one that sells the prints and stuff.
Banksy has also been to court before, fully represented by his lawyer. The odds of them not knowing precisely who he is are fairly low, I believe.
Fubarberry@sopuli.xyz
on 12 Sep 16:30
nextcollapse
I’ve long heard that his identity is an open secret and a lot of people know his actual identity. Solid chance the UK government already knows who he is.
I’m pretty sure there’s plenty of people out there who know exactly who Banksy is. It’ll be like with The Stig, all the journalists knew who he was but the mystery was more interesting and sold more papers.
TachyonTele@piefed.social
on 12 Sep 18:18
nextcollapse
Banksy is a company at this point. They can find them if they want to. It's not like they've never exchanged money for thier work before.
Wildmimic@anarchist.nexus
on 12 Sep 18:52
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Rumors (which are even on Wikipedia) say it's Robert Del Naja from Massive Attack, who started as a graffiti artist. Bansky told interviewers that he was inspired by Del Naja.
Imagine if it isn’t Del Naja, yet everytime he travels somewhere someone puts up a Banksy near you. I’d feel so powerful and in control of that happened to me all the time.
Careful what you wish for. I’m not disagreeing, but when the powerful are fearful, it will get worse before it gets better. Could be a whole lot worse.
Infernal_pizza@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 12 Sep 17:29
nextcollapse
Pretty sure that’s what’s happening now with all the online safety act chat control protesters are actually terrorists stuff
Tbf it would be pretty cool if he uploaded the templates for the artwork online, together with a how to, that way the piece could be put on walls by anyone.
gedaliyah@lemmy.world
on 12 Sep 16:18
nextcollapse
Oh no! That is so scary. I hope that whoever it is doesn’t have decades of experience in working and traveling anonymously around the world while performing illegal acts of guerilla artwork while evading both the legal authorities and an adoring public fanbase!
Hmm it’s almost like choosing a persona isn’t just about sounding cool.
ShittyBeatlesFCPres@lemmy.world
on 12 Sep 16:50
nextcollapse
The article says it could result in a fine that’s based on the value of the damage. You’d think having a famous artist’s work would increase the value of the building.
Interesting. “The value of the damage.” I’d say it’s pretty likely the Banksy worked increased the value of the wall, if not the whole property. So is that negative damage? The people who decreased the value where those who tried to clean off the artwork.
svcg@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 13 Sep 01:01
nextcollapse
The building is already a Grade I listed building.
Ah yes, going after world renowned artist for graffiti because he made them feel bad. Truth speaking to power will always be unpopular with those in power.
ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 12 Sep 18:15
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I mean tbh they go after all the world renowned graffiti artists, as by nature graffiti is illegal. There are plenty muralists that aren’t sought after by the authorities because they only paint legal (…under that name anyway…) but by definition graffiti is a crime.
He’s not because people not into graff know him so if he writes on your building it’s worth money, yaaay. Even though those who know graff know him as a biter, for his copying of Blek Le Rat.
I mean tbh they go after all the world renowned graffiti artists
If it were some random dude writing some random letters, they probably would put in a lot of effort though; because the effort isn’t because of material damage.
ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 12 Sep 21:58
collapse
Yeah, JA XTC, MQ, Kez 5 (dead), Semz, Zexor (dead), Risk, Cost & Revs, Kuma, Wanto, Pixote, Earsnot, Seen, etc on and on, all those dudes are still or were* (*either caught and now paint that name legally or died) being actively hunted by the cops specifically because of the material damage. I wouldn’t know from experience or anything I’ve never written on anything and you have no proof to the contrary.
Banksy isn’t sought for criminal charges, he’s sought because he’s “famous.” I’m sure he would face charges because he is at least doing his street art illegally, but it’s absolutely not the same treatment someone like Jase or Ich would get bombing reefers, much less someone like MQ.
Thanks. Seeing this collection of names in a post on lemmy dropped my jaw. All city.
ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 13 Sep 04:51
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Hell yeah lol, stay up!
SonOfAntenora@lemmy.world
on 13 Sep 12:07
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No it’s not entirely true some graffiti are even protected after being recognised as art.
ArcaneSlime@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 13 Sep 13:36
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Right, for people as famous as Banksy and nobody else, that’s partly what I’m talking about. Sure legal murals get protected all the time but writers/bombers (like King Robbo who banksy dissed,) and even most “street artists” who don’t write, (like Blek Le Rat, who Banksy bit) get chased by the cops (or train yard bulls), it’s the name of the game, and frankly it wouldn’t be as fun without it.
Banksy is as much a person as Nicolas Bourbaki was. Although unlike Bourbaki, there is allegedly one guy who is kind of the main guy, but if that one guy goes to prison, I'm fairly certain Bansky artworks will continue to appear.
In fact I'd put money on the fact that one would appear in a prominent place soon after.
And if the establishment somehow manage to round up every single person associated with Banksy and manage to get something to stick to every single one of them, which I strongly doubt is possible, the rise in wannabe Banksy groups doing the same thing won't be far off.
The artwork is almost always made with stencils and spray paints. Stencils can be prepared well in advance. A trained group could have one of these up in under a couple of minutes.
If I was Banksy - or one of them - I would almost certainly have distributed my art to trusted individuals for the event of my incarceration and beyond.
That is the vibe the UK government gives in particular sometimes. There’s been a few issues over the past decade and a bit where they just haven’t given a fuck about privacy, free speech or recourse against the authorities.
It’s mistake to think that way, though, because the nation actually is a democracy now.
DrFistington@lemmy.world
on 12 Sep 22:16
nextcollapse
Do they realize how famous and beloved that person will be if they are identified?
IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world
on 13 Sep 02:14
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I just want him up be the most unexpected person.
like Lord buckethead, or the most gammon looking brit on the island
Or trans and from an immigrant family. Banksy is a national treasure as this point and it would be a nice win for British culture and minorities if they turn out not to be just another white guy.
IAmNorRealTakeYourMeds@lemmy.world
on 13 Sep 11:23
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that would also be cool.
sp3ctr4l@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 12 Sep 22:42
nextcollapse
Could everyone in London just suddenly adopt a fashion trend of wearing V for Vendetta masks?
Regrettable_incident@lemmy.world
on 13 Sep 16:32
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Fuck me that guy looks just like me.
I never met him myself, but I know a few people who have done way back. Site crew in Bristol mostly. Rip useless Paul who had one of his rats on the side of his trailer.
No… they just have become more repressive and no longer tolerate being called out. This is a scary reaction for democracy for just a painting on a wall.
All the other Banksy’s I can think of are just vaguely subversive about the system in general. CCTVs, Policemen kissing, hoodie wearer throwing flowers, assorted things about urban decay, that sort of thing. This is the first one I can think of that calls out a specific current event that you can attach names to.
Roger Hallam - one of the founders of extinction rebellion - did a series of podcasts from prison I listened to several years back now. He spoke of this move to authoritarianism being an almost inevitable part of the process that can result in a chance of real social change.
I think his assessment of climate change is wrong in some pretty important aspects. But he has studied social change, and he has put his money where his mouth is. He is locked up now I think. It will take quite a few more people to get locked or beaten up, and a further march towards authoritariansim, before the chance of real social change arises, if he is correct.
UpperBroccoli@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 13 Sep 10:11
nextcollapse
UK, what the bloody hell is wrong with you.
Regrettable_incident@lemmy.world
on 13 Sep 16:26
collapse
Our current government is the labour party, the one of the big two that is supposed to be more left leaning. They haven’t been left leaning in twenty years, they crept to centrist and now the creep to the right continues. They’re not dissimilar from the democrats in America. Internationally, there seems to be a general move towards the right and we are certainly following it. Demonstrations and activism don’t seem to help. Shit is fucked, basically.
The UK government as effectively ignored all protests since the poll tax riots. The choice seems either start acting like the French or just sit down and shut up.
Regrettable_incident@lemmy.world
on 14 Sep 04:32
collapse
Yeah, and I’ve been on some actions that have kicked off, back in the day, fighting the lines of riot police. It was fun but achieved fuck all. Yeah we need many more people involved in aggressive protests. I don’t know if that will help either, but at least we need to mobilise a broader section of the population.
SonOfAntenora@lemmy.world
on 13 Sep 10:55
nextcollapse
The piece has not yet been claimed by Banksy, but Defend Our Juries suggested it was the artist’s work and depicted the “dystopian” proscription of Palestine Action
This state of paranoia can only result in worsening conditions for everyone.
So the state will assume he’s in support and jail him on assumptions? For a painting?
SonOfAntenora@lemmy.world
on 13 Sep 11:34
collapse
Apparently? Yes.
But stencil wall art is not Banksy’s exclusive art. Even of it looks like it, just assuming it’s banksy and treating the person as a criminal is dumb.
Also it seems repressing free speech does the exact opposite.
prettybunnys@sh.itjust.works
on 13 Sep 13:09
nextcollapse
Sounds to me like London just declared all their walls as open season
AcidiclyBasicGlitch@sh.itjust.works
on 13 Sep 17:29
nextcollapse
Fuck are you kidding me?
The plebs are getting rowdy. Surely this will send the message we’re hoping for and they’ll settle down.
threaded - newest
Gonna be hard to bring them to court if you don’t even know their name, isn’t it?
With the London surveillance apparatus, I bet they could figure out who Banksy is. It’d be an insane waste of time and resources, but I bet they could.
The fact that they’re going to all this trouble over this image proves the point the image was making better than anything else possibly could have.
Exactly and the image is already out on the internet now.
Link?
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/8f42901a-43db-47bd-9803-4ce0fc80020c.jpeg">
Before and after they tried to remove it only to further bolster the message
It’s almost like it was Banksy’s plan all along because the removed artwork looks just as powerful as the full artwork.
<img alt="The shadow of the Hiroshima resident seated on the Sumitomo bank steps." src="https://allthatsinteresting.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/steps-hiroshima-shadows.jpg">
Hiroshima shadows
Do you think it was intentional with the choice of paint, or did the person removing it intentionally scrub just the silhouette?
Looks like possible malicious compliance by the cleaning crew.
I know it’s what I’d do at least.
Honestly, they inadvertently made it better, and certainly made it more poignant
That is amazing. I love it when cesorship fucks its own ass lol.
This was the best I could find without people in it when it first went up:
<img alt="" src="https://files.catbox.moe/us12dp.jpg">
Streisand Effect to the max.
but, BUT, MUH LAW AND ORDER
If artwork is a threat to your system…
Does he still install them himself? Isn’t it likely he sent someone to do it for him?
Couldn’t tell ya, but that’s certainly plausible.
They have done both.
Could always make them waste even more resources by adding noise to what little data they might have.
I’m
SpartacusBanksy!I’M BANKSY!
I’m Banksy and so is my wife!
I saw my dog with a stencil yesterday. Maybe he’s Banksy.
Mine peed on a wall today. Maybe Banksy is a team?
Finally all that money they’re giving to antichrist speaker Peter Thiel going to good use
i don’t think it’d be that many resources. that’s why they put up the surveillance in the first place. so its easy to find anyone and no one can easily hide.
Seems like an opportunity for a bunch of street artists to show up at court and pull an “I’m Spartacus”.
He has sold some of his work at auction, I’m guessing they didn’t write a check to “Banksy”.
probably wrote the cheque to a shell company
There's two companies associated with the name, at least. This is from memory, so grain of salt, but i believe there's a company specifically to get a hold of the artist(s). And one that sells the prints and stuff.
Banksy has also been to court before, fully represented by his lawyer. The odds of them not knowing precisely who he is are fairly low, I believe.
I’ve long heard that his identity is an open secret and a lot of people know his actual identity. Solid chance the UK government already knows who he is.
Them silently knowing his identity is not the same as them proving his identity in court though.
I’m pretty sure there’s plenty of people out there who know exactly who Banksy is. It’ll be like with The Stig, all the journalists knew who he was but the mystery was more interesting and sold more papers.
Banksy is a company at this point. They can find them if they want to. It's not like they've never exchanged money for thier work before.
Rumors (which are even on Wikipedia) say it's Robert Del Naja from Massive Attack, who started as a graffiti artist. Bansky told interviewers that he was inspired by Del Naja.
If I was trying to keep my identity a secret, I wouldn’t say I was inspired by myself.
And not even in reverse-psychology way, because then the interviewer would probably look up Del Naja and an immediately make the connection.
Imagine if it isn’t Del Naja, yet everytime he travels somewhere someone puts up a Banksy near you. I’d feel so powerful and in control of that happened to me all the time.
Enough gas lighting to fill a Zeppelin.
Could have avoided the higher criminal charges by painting a building across the street, but this does demonstrate the insecurity of authority.
Nothing will meaningfully improve until the rich fear for their lives
Yup. It’s a one way trip to fascist dystopia until the oligarchs feel they might genuinely face the old French treatment.
Some prophecies are self fulfilling. Stalin’s paranoia didn’t kill him maybe, but it didn’t exactly save him.
Something about the parallel of Capitalism and Fascism eating themselves
Careful what you wish for. I’m not disagreeing, but when the powerful are fearful, it will get worse before it gets better. Could be a whole lot worse.
Pretty sure that’s what’s happening now with all the online safety act chat control protesters are actually terrorists stuff
Things are already getting worse at a rapid clip.
<img alt="" src="https://infosec.pub/pictrs/image/18f084fb-e239-4bdb-9530-7d539a5fa45f.jpeg">
Tbf it would be pretty cool if he uploaded the templates for the artwork online, together with a how to, that way the piece could be put on walls by anyone.
Oh no! That is so scary. I hope that whoever it is doesn’t have decades of experience in working and traveling anonymously around the world while performing illegal acts of guerilla artwork while evading both the legal authorities and an adoring public fanbase!
Hmm it’s almost like choosing a persona isn’t just about sounding cool.
The article says it could result in a fine that’s based on the value of the damage. You’d think having a famous artist’s work would increase the value of the building.
would be funny if courts did agree it was net increase to value if they didnt destroy it
Even funnier would be if they then put the cleaners in jail instead.
So really they devalued public property by destroying his artwork. I say bring the State up on charges.
How much does it cost to hire someone to pressure wash a wall for an hour in the UK?
But no, that’s an excellent point, removing the art work would actually be more damaging
Interesting. “The value of the damage.” I’d say it’s pretty likely the Banksy worked increased the value of the wall, if not the whole property. So is that negative damage? The people who decreased the value where those who tried to clean off the artwork.
The building is already a Grade I listed building.
So, if the damage increased the value of the building, it would necessitate the courts paying? Sounds reasonable.
Ah yes, going after world renowned artist for graffiti because he made them feel bad. Truth speaking to power will always be unpopular with those in power.
I mean tbh they go after all the world renowned graffiti artists, as by nature graffiti is illegal. There are plenty muralists that aren’t sought after by the authorities because they only paint legal (…under that name anyway…) but by definition graffiti is a crime.
He’s not because people not into graff know him so if he writes on your building it’s worth money, yaaay. Even though those who know graff know him as a biter, for his copying of Blek Le Rat.
If it were some random dude writing some random letters, they probably would put in a lot of effort though; because the effort isn’t because of material damage.
Yeah, JA XTC, MQ, Kez 5 (dead), Semz, Zexor (dead), Risk, Cost & Revs, Kuma, Wanto, Pixote, Earsnot, Seen, etc on and on, all those dudes are still or were* (*either caught and now paint that name legally or died) being actively hunted by the cops specifically because of the material damage. I wouldn’t know from experience or anything I’ve never written on anything and you have no proof to the contrary.
Banksy isn’t sought for criminal charges, he’s sought because he’s “famous.” I’m sure he would face charges because he is at least doing his street art illegally, but it’s absolutely not the same treatment someone like Jase or Ich would get bombing reefers, much less someone like MQ.
In conclusion, Team Robbo FTW fuck that biter.
Thanks. Seeing this collection of names in a post on lemmy dropped my jaw. All city.
Hell yeah lol, stay up!
No it’s not entirely true some graffiti are even protected after being recognised as art.
Right, for people as famous as Banksy and nobody else, that’s partly what I’m talking about. Sure legal murals get protected all the time but writers/bombers (like King Robbo who banksy dissed,) and even most “street artists” who don’t write, (like Blek Le Rat, who Banksy bit) get chased by the cops (or train yard bulls), it’s the name of the game, and frankly it wouldn’t be as fun without it.
Banksy is as much a person as Nicolas Bourbaki was. Although unlike Bourbaki, there is allegedly one guy who is kind of the main guy, but if that one guy goes to prison, I'm fairly certain Bansky artworks will continue to appear.
In fact I'd put money on the fact that one would appear in a prominent place soon after.
And if the establishment somehow manage to round up every single person associated with Banksy and manage to get something to stick to every single one of them, which I strongly doubt is possible, the rise in wannabe Banksy groups doing the same thing won't be far off.
The artwork is almost always made with stencils and spray paints. Stencils can be prepared well in advance. A trained group could have one of these up in under a couple of minutes.
If I was Banksy - or one of them - I would almost certainly have distributed my art to trusted individuals for the event of my incarceration and beyond.
I mean, if it’s multiple people and the ones not incarcerated don’t immediately drop more art, I’d be disappointed.
I wonder how close they could get to putting one on the jail.
Damage is all of their own doing. Every move they make just damages them more.
So they destroyed a priceless artwork, and are essentially planning to kill graffiti Santa next.
I wonder who’s ordering this, and if they’re aware it will not help the public opinion problem they’re having.
Well Labour is just a different flavour of the Conservative Party. So it does track.
Ah, it’s like that over there, too. Welcome to the party.
I’m pretty sure they no longer care about public opinion, they’re confident there’s nothing we can (or will) do.
That is the vibe the UK government gives in particular sometimes. There’s been a few issues over the past decade and a bit where they just haven’t given a fuck about privacy, free speech or recourse against the authorities.
It’s mistake to think that way, though, because the nation actually is a democracy now.
Do they realize how famous and beloved that person will be if they are identified?
I just want him up be the most unexpected person.
like Lord buckethead, or the most gammon looking brit on the island
Or trans and from an immigrant family. Banksy is a national treasure as this point and it would be a nice win for British culture and minorities if they turn out not to be just another white guy.
that would also be cool.
Could everyone in London just suddenly adopt a fashion trend of wearing V for Vendetta masks?
… Or is that already illegal?
The UK, in collaboration with the US, has been a surveillance state for over 15 years. Now is becoming an authoritarian one too.
youtu.be/PoY_GboFMjc
I am banksy.
spits out chewing tobacco
leans forward in chair, causing spurs to ring
adjusts cattleman hat
squints
Well.
Ain’t that just the darndest coincidence.
Me too.
Spikes my Mohawk with egg white
causing an uncomfortable squishing sound
folds the collar down of my spiked leather jacket
spits the taste of last night’s beer out my mouth
looks up and around confused
Why do I suddenly feel like a forty year old recluse?
Not sure pard’ner, but I got this here onion in my cross holster, if ya’ need it.
Same tho
They’re determined to Streisand Effect this into the history books, huh?
“We must catch this villain who is making public edifices worth millions to our oligarchs!!”
I’m pretty sure they already unmasked Banksy
<img alt="" src="https://sh.itjust.works/pictrs/image/e469f902-eeba-4d4b-a0c9-be3a5e8206b7.jpeg">
Jontron with a wig?
JonWHO? That’s Banksy! (Aka definitely not Bruce from FunHaus)
That’s not him
We are all Banksy on this glorious day
Will the real Banksy please stand up
This is Banksy. That kid is much too young cmon <img alt="" src="https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/6ef2972a-a935-4476-8072-05838400b131.jpeg">
Fuck me that guy looks just like me.
I never met him myself, but I know a few people who have done way back. Site crew in Bristol mostly. Rip useless Paul who had one of his rats on the side of his trailer.
Well I’m a fan. His social commentary is on point and much needed. I hope his erased mural gets repainted somewhere else nearby
I reckon any street artist understands that their work is temporary. It probably got more publicity by being removed. Streisand effect at work again.
He has been ‘unmasked’ several times. Kind of a pretty non-descript middle class-ish bloke in jeans etc.
So telling that they tolerated his “criminal damage” for literally decades, until it made them actually look bad.
No… they just have become more repressive and no longer tolerate being called out. This is a scary reaction for democracy for just a painting on a wall.
All the other Banksy’s I can think of are just vaguely subversive about the system in general. CCTVs, Policemen kissing, hoodie wearer throwing flowers, assorted things about urban decay, that sort of thing. This is the first one I can think of that calls out a specific current event that you can attach names to.
Roger Hallam - one of the founders of extinction rebellion - did a series of podcasts from prison I listened to several years back now. He spoke of this move to authoritarianism being an almost inevitable part of the process that can result in a chance of real social change.
I think his assessment of climate change is wrong in some pretty important aspects. But he has studied social change, and he has put his money where his mouth is. He is locked up now I think. It will take quite a few more people to get locked or beaten up, and a further march towards authoritariansim, before the chance of real social change arises, if he is correct.
UK, what the bloody hell is wrong with you.
Our current government is the labour party, the one of the big two that is supposed to be more left leaning. They haven’t been left leaning in twenty years, they crept to centrist and now the creep to the right continues. They’re not dissimilar from the democrats in America. Internationally, there seems to be a general move towards the right and we are certainly following it. Demonstrations and activism don’t seem to help. Shit is fucked, basically.
The UK government as effectively ignored all protests since the poll tax riots. The choice seems either start acting like the French or just sit down and shut up.
Yeah, and I’ve been on some actions that have kicked off, back in the day, fighting the lines of riot police. It was fun but achieved fuck all. Yeah we need many more people involved in aggressive protests. I don’t know if that will help either, but at least we need to mobilise a broader section of the population.
This state of paranoia can only result in worsening conditions for everyone.
So the state will assume he’s in support and jail him on assumptions? For a painting?
Apparently? Yes. But stencil wall art is not Banksy’s exclusive art. Even of it looks like it, just assuming it’s banksy and treating the person as a criminal is dumb. Also it seems repressing free speech does the exact opposite.
Sounds to me like London just declared all their walls as open season
Fuck are you kidding me?
The plebs are getting rowdy. Surely this will send the message we’re hoping for and they’ll settle down.
They can (attempt to) unmask Bansky all they want but his message will never die. Best wishes Banksy!