And as the Visigoths ransacked Rome, Emperor Honorius was heard yelling, “not my Cybertruck!“
bolditalicroman@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 19:06
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Ah, what a time to be alive: Pedo nazis are trying to take over the U.S. (and other parts of the world), and we‘re driving around in swasticars. Sounds like the plot of some 80‘s movie, but somehow it’s the reality we live in. And, somehow, where I live (central Europe), people are still voting for right-wing parties, seeing what is happening, seeing history repeating itself. This ignorance is infathomable to me, and I can only hope that either we will never suffer the consequences of what we‘re voting for or we learn it for real this time.
daychilde@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 06:51
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Pedo nazis are trying to take over the U.S.
Alas, not sure about “trying”, but yes.
biofaust@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 14:38
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I am sure this is what Rubio meant when he said that they “need Europe to help save the West” the other day. Right?
JoMiran@lemmy.ml
on 17 Feb 2026 14:44
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dxgsthrr@feddit.uk
on 17 Feb 2026 14:51
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The FY2025 vs FY2024 numbers were plenty damning. Comparing January 2026 to previous Januaries is kinda silly given how much monthly fluctuation there is, and how few markets actually report on Monthly numbers
Lemmyoutofhere@lemmy.ca
on 17 Feb 2026 14:57
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That’s a good start.
saltesc@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 15:02
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Look. I know Norway be cool in this, but I’m actually kind of shocked at just 93%.
Edit: Though, looking at the figures, makes sense. Business as usual if you don’t consider the one-off spike they’re comparing to to get that figured.
f314@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 15:11
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Yeah, the numbers for Norway are when the cars are registered, which happens when they arrive at the dealer. Since Tesla ships their cars in large batches, the numbers are difficult to compare.
I’m (unfortunately) certain that most of the decline in sales will disappear once the first big delivery of 2026 comes ashore.
Got no clue on reliability of the source, but there’s 3 on top of my search seem to line up.
electrotabby@piefed.social
on 17 Feb 2026 19:10
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IIRC tax reasons made it very much smarter to buy a Tesla in Dec 2025 than in Jan 2026. Norway has had a drop in sales, but stuff like this skews the numbers.
“Gonna buy a nazi mobile yet?”
“Nah, I have ethics.”
“They will be more expensive next year though”
Runs to the dealership
Paddzr@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 20:23
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I think we underestimate how much the public cares… Reddit/Lemmy tend to be a very big echo chambers and we’ve seen several big events where online discource was completely at odds with reality. It still doesn’t explain how the increase. Because up until today, I believed Europe stopped buying them, but then the figures pedalled are fucking fake. Not sure how your place does it, but here the year of the car is on a reg plate… I see a lot of new teslas, far more than any other EV. I’ve seen couple of Renault 5s! Those are cool. But in the +40k mark? Just teslas. Despite allegedly MG making a Tesla killer a year ago, I’ve yet to see a single one.
The incredible thing isn’t the slight down tick in sales last year (on par with most international car companies), but that Tesla has a market cap that exceeds both of these mega-manufacturers despite being dwarfed in both assets and revenues.
On paper, they have so much farther to fall than what these short term sales shortfalls imply. But then this is a car company that’s defied gravity for a decade. Consider that each vehicle Tesla sells reflects $700k - $1M in market cap. On a $60k-$110k vehicle.
All their valuation is predicated on future predicted returns on the technology rather than current sales figures. And I don’t know when that will actually change.
Voroxpete@sh.itjust.works
on 17 Feb 2026 15:12
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It’s very clear that at this point, insofar as there is any logic at all to the decision making of people investing in Tesla (and there’s very little evidence of that), they’re evaluating it as a software company, not a car company.
This seems to be largely based on the notion that Tesla is the world leader in self-driving, and poised to become the world leader in other areas of automation. And that would, admittedly, mostly justify their very high share price, if there was literally any evidence it was true. Of course, what they actually have is a self-driving system that is only number one in fatalities caused, and a bunch of faked demos of robots made using low paid remote operators.
Tesla is easily the single best demonstration of how fucked our economic system really is. That a company can so blatantly lie, over and over, about what their products can actually do, and somehow continue to see their share price increase tells you everything you need to know about how utterly fictitious the entire notion of the stock market is.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 15:16
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they’re evaluating it as a software company, not a car company.
That still doesn’t justify the valuation. Tesla’s market cap is 3x Oracle’s, ffs. It’s half of a Microsoft. No software they produce can justify this valuation.
Palantir and NVIDIA have the same hyper-inflated position. Nothing in their projected revenue figures can explain their company’s valuation, unless you’re just hand-waving and predicting 10-20x growth over the next decade.
Tesla is easily the single best demonstration of how fucked our economic system really is. That a company can so blatantly lie, over and over, about what their products can actually do, and somehow continue to see their share price increase tells you everything you need to know about how utterly fictitious the entire notion of the stock market is.
Warren Buffet definitely gearing up to print off another deck of “Fell For It Again” awards. Only question is when they get handed out.
Voroxpete@sh.itjust.works
on 17 Feb 2026 15:47
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unless you’re just hand-waving and predicting 10-20x growth over the next decade.
That’s exactly what they’re doing.
The problem is that hyper-advanced automation is essentially unpriceable. When your potential market penetration is “replace all human labour” your profit potential is infinite.
The real is issue is not how they’re pricing the potential upside, its that none of these companies have remotely demonstrated that they have the ability to actually produce that upside. It’s an entire industry shilling a fantasy on the back of some very impressive sales demos.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 15:54
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The problem is that hyper-advanced automation is essentially unpriceable.
I mean, I could point you to a few economics journalists who would argue otherwise. Ed Zitron’s been screaming about the downfall of AI for the last two years straight.
But the market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent, as the saying goes.
It’s an entire industry shilling a fantasy on the back of some very impressive sales demos.
Doesn’t hurt to have a bunch of tech-friendly goobers running state and federal governments who are turning out the taxpayer’s wallet to finance these hallucinations.
Voroxpete@sh.itjust.works
on 17 Feb 2026 16:55
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I mean, I could point you to a few economics journalists who would argue otherwise. Ed Zitron’s been screaming about the downfall of AI for the last two years straight.
I feel like you’re only reading every other sentence of what I say. In this instance, you seem to have fixated on this part, but sailed right past the part where I said that there’s zero evidence that anyone can actually produce hyper-advanced automation. I never argued that it was a rational decision to go all in on this possibility, and that’s entirely clear from my previous comments.
Ed Zitron is completely correct, but he’s also making exactly the same argument I am; that these people cannot actually achieve the technological revolution they are promising. That doesn’t change the fact that, if their wish granting genie was real, it would basically have unlimited upside. The problem is not how they’re pricing the outcome, the problem is how they’re evaluating the probability of achieving the outcome.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 17:07
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there’s zero evidence that anyone can actually produce hyper-advanced automation
There’s plenty of evidence (Waymo, for instance, or Xaiome) that companies can produce “good enough” advanced automation. Tesla’s just not the guy to make it happen. Same with AI. Very possible to produce useful tools (Alibaba’s Deepseek, Insilico Medicine’s Pharma.AI, etc) with LLMs. Sam Altman’s just not doing it.
Ed Zitron is completely correct, but he’s also making exactly the same argument I am; that these people cannot actually achieve the technological revolution they are promising.
Zitron’s heavily focused on the economics. Specifically, he’s fixated on the cost of running the American data centers relative to their prospective future revenues and profit horizons. He’s not even “anti-Tech” relatively speaking. He’s just reading balance sheets and doing basic math on depreciation rate of hardware to conclude the current business models won’t work.
This isn’t to say it can’t happen. It’s to say these businesses won’t make it happen.
The problem is not how they’re pricing the outcome
This is where we’re in disagreement. They’re pricing their outcomes totally wrong, even in their self-proclaimed “best case scenario”. That’s leading them toward malinvestment - heavy spending on hardware and brute force algorithms. Marginal investment on material applications and workflow integrations that benefit anyone.
This isn’t a probability problem where they can luck into a multi-trillion dollar windfall.
Voroxpete@sh.itjust.works
on 17 Feb 2026 17:50
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Again, we’re still in that “reading every over sentence” mode. For example, I say “hyper-advanced automation” and you reply claiming that “Good enough” automation is perfectly achievable. Yes. I know. I never said it wasn’t. I never said anything about good enough automation at all. And that kind of thing goes on throughout your response here.
By all means continue your conversation with whoever you think is making all these arguments, but they bare little resemblance to anything I’m saying, so there’s really no point in my responding any further.
Buffalox@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 22:26
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“Good enough”
Here “Good enough” matches the quality of most car brands and AFAIK surpasses Tesla.
To get quality like BMW or Mercedes, is probably only a matter of the automation being more expensive, there is no reason to think for instance Xiaomi couldn’t make higher quality automated assembly on more expensive cars.
Tesla assembly sucks, I have often heard reviewers complain about noises you wouldn’t find in way cheaper European cars.
Buffalox@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 22:21
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Kudos for mentioning Xiaomi, they recently showed off their newest car factory, and it’s insanely highly automated, with workers basically only doing quality control!
China is probably the new masters of mass production, which I suppose is natural considering they have a home market of 1.4 billion people, they can invest in mass production for China only, and have a scale that is 4 times the scale of USA!
No country has ever had such a massive home market before China, and I think it’s a huge advantage for China regarding mass production.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 22:43
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No country has ever had such a massive home market before China
glances at India
But then that’s just the BRICS in a nutshell. Five countries with enormous internal consumer demand, which can afford to develop domestically to meet the needs of their local populations without worrying too much about export markets.
Buffalox@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 09:42
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And has bigger population, but way lower economy.
With everything comparable like cars, China is now by far the biggest market in the world.
phutatorius@lemmy.zip
on 21 Feb 2026 18:04
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Sam Altman’s just not doing it.
Just to be clear to those who might not get deeply into these things: Sam Altman is a salesman, and has no technical role within OpenAI. His job is to milk the VC tittie, to pump up the share price, to seek government subsidies, and to promise users the moon on a stick.
phutatorius@lemmy.zip
on 21 Feb 2026 18:01
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if their wish granting genie was real, it would basically have unlimited upside
Another way of putting that is that, if for once, some of Elmo’s endlessly disproven hyperbole is in fact true, it’d have unlimited upside. So yeah, the chance of Tesla achieving a miracle is vanishingly slim.
It’s very clear that at this point, insofar as there is any logic at all to the decision making of people investing in Tesla (and there’s very little evidence of that), they’re evaluating it as a software company, not a car company.
Nah, the logic to the decision is that other people are buying a lot of tesla stock and the price keeps going up. It’s very nearly a ponzi scheme. It has value completely detached to what the company is doing. It’s tulips, crypto, beanie babies. Most institutional investors realizes this, they also are trying to get in and get out without holding the bag.
Voroxpete@sh.itjust.works
on 17 Feb 2026 16:56
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It’s very clear that at this point, insofar as there is any logic at all to the decision making of people investing in Tesla (and there’s very little evidence of that), they’re evaluating it as a software company, not a car company.
venusaur@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 15:54
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Remember WeWork? Lots of dumb people with money and if enough dumb people sustain their dumbness it doesn’t really matter. Stock goes up.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 16:12
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Remember WeWork?
Boy howdy. You know Adam Neumann is still worth $2.2B?
Crazy how that happens.
venusaur@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 16:26
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Frustrating as hell. Losing a few mil means nothing to billions.
gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works
on 17 Feb 2026 16:03
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It’s honestly quite unhinged when you look at how much each vehicle contributes to their market cap.
a4ng3l@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 16:44
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What a beautiful way to present the situation.
ApplyingAutomation@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 02:42
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Genuinely ~ i’d read his take on other issues!
Paddzr@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 17:28
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So if sales are down 50% or more in Europe, where are these cars sold?
Lemmyoutofhere@lemmy.ca
on 17 Feb 2026 17:47
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UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 17:48
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For starters, SpaceX, which operates the Starlink satellite network, has purchased over 1,000 Tesla Cybertrucks as of late 2025.
Meanwhile, Police departments across the U.S. - particularly in California - are increasingly adopting Tesla vehicles (Model Y, Model 3, and Cybertruck) for patrol and administrative use. South Pasadena (CA) became the first U.S. city to switch its entire police patrol fleet to electric vehicles. Other departments, including Anaheim and Fremont, are using Tesla Model Ys for patrol. The Las Vegas Metro Police Department is introducing a fleet of 10 Cybertrucks for patrol and tactical use, specifically highlighting their safety features (bullet-resistant). A Texas school district created it’s own police force to be equipped with 9 Tesla cruisers two years back.
The Model Y is the new Crown Vic.
phutatorius@lemmy.zip
on 21 Feb 2026 18:08
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It’s worth noting that SpaceX buying Tesla is Musk selling to Musk. Leaving that aside, there’s no demand for Cybertrucks except that which has been pumped up by Musk and by the rotten Trumpkin.
UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world
on 21 Feb 2026 19:04
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there’s no demand for Cybertrucks
I wish that were true. But the Cult of Elon is strong. I see quite a few of them in Houston
Lemmyoutofhere@lemmy.ca
on 17 Feb 2026 17:44
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Tesla stock price is a load of crap, pushed up solely by Elon chuds.
Bytemeister@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 19:25
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I think the 3 things Tesla has/had going for them was…
Car sales growth. The had some pretty ridiculous growth in sales for a few years there.
Captive Market. Pretty much everyone I know with a Tesla charges at home, or at a Tesla supercharger. They’ve got the Apple ecosystem lock in for the “fuel” you put in the car. This walled garden approach basically lets Apple print money.
Technology. FSD, autopilot, and manufacturing. Tesla presented as a very tech focused company that was dumping money into R&D similar to how Amazon built up in the early 2000s. Investors love companies that are poised to control the entire market in the future.
Pretty much all 3 of these pillars have collapsed now. Their car sales are in a huge global slump. More cars are available that can charge on other charging networks, and those charging networks get bigger and better every day. Elon’s FSD is basically vaporware at this point, and the high degree of automation Tesla was touting in their factories came back to bite them in the ass.
This leads to my favorite recent quote about stocks though… “The market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.” Let’s face it, Tesla stock is a bubble, AI is a huge bubble. The problem isn’t knowing that there is a bubble, the problem is knowing when that bubble is going to burst.
CeeBee_Eh@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 03:05
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One thing you’re missing is that about 1/3 of Tesla’s profits were from selling carbon credits to other manufacturers. That disappeared recently also.
Wispy2891@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 06:33
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What? How is possible that Ford is only 4x the global volume of Tesla? In my European country I see Ford everywhere while Teslas are a rare bird.
Maybe the Chinese sales are influencing those numbers? (Ford doesn’t sell as Ford in China but as a joint venture)
Wispy2891@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 08:17
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Apparently the numbers are real, even if in the Tesla numbers there are 600k for China.
Also, I didn’t notice that Ford nowadays only focuses on the premium market and sells way less units than 20 years ago, the Fords I’m seeing around are the cheaper fiesta and ka that are now discontinued
AMoralNihilist@feddit.uk
on 18 Feb 2026 09:58
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How many of those fords have been sold in only the past 2-3 years?
Hell, a lot of the “latest” models of ford (in terms of appearance) are as old as Tesla sales
Wispy2891@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 14:20
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I was biased by the big amount of the cheaper models that they used to sell until 2023. In the new car marketshare they crashed from 8% to 3% now that the cheapest option they’re offering is 30k instead of 15k
Maybe you just notice the Fords more because they’re all monster trucks these days.
phutatorius@lemmy.zip
on 21 Feb 2026 17:57
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I suspect many investors are betting that, in the near term at least, Trump will rig things in Musk’s favor. Don’t assume they only consider the traditional fundamentals of corporate valuation.
Ludicrous0251@piefed.zip
on 17 Feb 2026 15:06
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Textbook case of how to absolutely obliterate first-mover advantage. Pretty remarkable actually.
WanderingThoughts@europe.pub
on 17 Feb 2026 15:24
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Tesla cars also fail the mandatory safety inspections in Europe at an alarming rate. That’s not a good look when buying a new car.
daychilde@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 06:54
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They’re also notoriously terrible build quality.
I will give Tesla credit for one solitary thing: They did help jumpstart electrics. Help. Not cause.
But that has been picked up by real car manufacturers, who just need more encouragement to continue to increase numbers, along with infrastructure projects to bring more charging stations to more places. A critical area would be for installations in places like apartment parking lots and various public parking lots (i.e. paid parking but I mean shopping lots)
Safetyshaft@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 16:41
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Tesla is a scam and money laundering operation.
I took a tour of their factory in the mid-2010s because a friend worked there in their training and development department, he was in charge of everyone who wrote assembly guides/processes.
He told me they’ve always operated at a loss and relied on “shifty Elon” and that he’d never buy one but the money was great working there.
Nowadays I see so many incompetent Asian and Indian buffoons driving around the Bay Area in their Teslas, supporting this shit company and its wannabe Nazi CEO.
You can tell someone is incompetent because they’re Asian or Indian?.. Holy racism Batman!
dogslayeggs@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 21:00
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No, the sentence is missing a comma. The incompetent driver part is the factual point of the observation. The casual mentioning of Asian and Indian is the racist part.
Safetyshaft@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 01:23
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Review my response above and get back to me when you come to your senses.
No racism involved here. Just facts.
dogslayeggs@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 16:24
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I did and laughed at it. Then I replied with actual facts to debunk your racist “facts.”
Safetyshaft@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 16:38
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I see no reply whatsoever.
Safetyshaft@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 01:14
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I love how you go straight to crying racism when it’s not that in the slightest. It’s simple math and factual information. Poor driving in those cultures is exceedingly common.
They do not often come from countries where there are proper traffic laws or where people actually obey whatever traffic laws there may be. They just go where they want when they want and good luck to you if you’re in the way. Go look at videos of driving in those countries and prove me wrong.
Where I live and work the population is 75+% Asian and Indian and they are the ones driving the overwhelming majority of the Teslas and literally asleep at the wheel or watching a movie or don’t care whatsoever who or what is around them on the road. They look at you like you’re crazy when you called them out on something terribly unsafe that they did on the road next to you in front of you or otherwise near you. They look at you like you’re crazy when you try to let them know that they don’t have any working brake lights - This is my favorite one I see all the time.
There are weekly or more than once per week posts on local subreddits and elsewhere about terrible driving here.
Nothing racist about it or me, it’s just facts. Those two videos I linked show you just a tiny sample of the nonsense we see here. Get off your goddamn high horse and don’t call me a racist.
I co-coach a little league team with Asian and Indian dads, work with many smart Asian and Indian people, I have nothing personally against these people, I’m just stating pure facts as it pertains to driving and Tesla ownership in this area.
Not sorry if you can’t handle that.
dogslayeggs@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 16:48
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OK, let’s talk facts, since that is what you are using to justify your casual racism.
CA has a much larger population of Asian and Indian people than TX, with 17% Asian (including Indian) versus 6.4%. Based on your “factual” data, that would mean that CA should have more traffic accidents, right? Then why does TX have a 20% higher fatal accident rate than CA? Let’s say it is because they drive faster out there on the open roads than we do in crowded cities. Then why does TX have a 40% higher overall accident rate than CA? These are statistics adjusted by population, so it isn’t just because CA has a higher population. We drive in high traffic more often and should have more accidents. Yet we don’t.
OK, let’s just say TX is its own crazy ass world, since it is. Let’s look at Santa Clara County versus Los Angeles County. Both are high population cities with high Asian populations and mild weather. Santa Clara County is 43% Asian, while LA County is 16.4% Asian. Based on your “factual” analysis, we should expect a MUCH higher traffic accident rate in Santa Clara County. Then why does LA County have a 30% higher accident rate than Santa Clara County?
Look, it’s OK to be a little bit racist. We all are. Just recognize it and learn more about yourself and the world around you.
Safetyshaft@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 17:11
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www.thehindu.com/news/…/article70361512.ece 485 people die per day on Indian roads, 177,000+ people a year, and a figure that is likely underreported given the stances of several international organizations such as the WHO.
India also has a significant underreporting problem confirmed by multiple independent studies. Some suggesting that fatal accidents are as much as 40% under-reported tripc.iitd.ac.in/assets/…/RSI_2023_web.pdf
Paranoidfactoid@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 17:43
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No worries! The stock price keeps going up, so it doesn’t matter how many cars Tesla actually sells.
Fedizen@lemmy.world
on 17 Feb 2026 17:47
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Luckily most his real income is from the US government and consumers cannot impoverish this level headed and clear minded ketamine addict with their misguided purchasing decisions.
Nikola Tesla style tech, not Tesla Corporation style tech. Emanipatory tech, not rentier tech. Spaceships for everybody, not cars and rockets for the rich enough.
BarneyPiccolo@lemmy.today
on 18 Feb 2026 02:02
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Their bubble is slowly leaking, and it will never inflate again. Tesla will be bankrupt in 3 years.
TehWorld@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 02:41
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There are plenty of MAGA sheep, plus Teslas still seem to be super popular among the transplants from India in my area to keep the company around for a long time. SpaceX & Starlink have essentially no competition and Musk will just pivot.
Corporal_Punishment@feddit.uk
on 18 Feb 2026 05:48
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Means that too many people are still buying teslas though.
My friend has one. When I saw her I asked if she knew there was dog shit on her drive. She came out and asked where. Wasn’t hapoy when I pointed at her tesla.
metermatic26@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 06:56
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Attaboy, make her regret it every second you’re around
Species8472@discuss.tchncs.de
on 18 Feb 2026 08:27
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When she asked you if you think that was funny, did you reply with “heil no”?
Corporal_Punishment@feddit.uk
on 18 Feb 2026 08:35
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Lol she didnt ask.
She just called me a dickhead
OleFoFa@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 05:57
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I’d like to see this article’s sources for the Norwegian sales number. Unfortunately, most other sources point to an about 40% increase in Tesla sales here last year. I generally like my country’s adoption of evs (I’m on my third), but the fact that the muskrat keeps selling cars in norway massively bugs me :/
NoMoreCocaine@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 17:25
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IIRC that was because of the legislation change? Something about luxury vehicles thing stuff cheap thing change…projections are that it’ll crater this year? But I have zero sources, but that’s a starting point for a search, I guess. I’m about to start watching a gig so I’ll leave that someone better.
Wispy2891@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 06:46
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List of stuff that I can’t accept from a vehicle:
If it’s created by a Nazi
If the gear selector is on a touchscreen
If the blinkers are on a touch button
If the wipers are on a menu on a touchscreen
If it has no support for Android auto or carplay
If it requires a subscription for something that is already present at moment of purchase or is done locally by the headunit
If the doors don’t have a mechanical unlock from outside or inside (no, the mechanical unlock from inside it’s too hidden to be considered, in case of emergency nobody will be able to find it before being burned alive - even in a hidden room game they don’t hide levers under rubber mats in drawers)
atthecoast@feddit.nl
on 18 Feb 2026 10:02
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Well at point one, you’ve lost Volkswagen
Wispy2891@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 14:21
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Volkswagen also does subscription for heated seats
Regrettable_incident@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 21:28
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And lies about emissions.
SaveTheTuaHawk@lemmy.ca
on 18 Feb 2026 17:29
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Mercedes and BMW both worked for Hitler, even Porsche.
phutatorius@lemmy.zip
on 21 Feb 2026 17:54
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Ferdinand Porsche designed the original Volkswagen. There’s a very strong argument to be made that he was a Nazi.
phutatorius@lemmy.zip
on 21 Feb 2026 17:49
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If it’s created by a Nazi
Leon didn’t create it. He just bought the company. But for me, Nazi ownership is a bigger deal anyway.
Mwa@thelemmy.club
on 18 Feb 2026 10:04
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how about on non-european countries is it the same?
TheKingBombOmbKiller@lemmy.zip
on 18 Feb 2026 16:51
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Norway as well.
Mwa@thelemmy.club
on 18 Feb 2026 18:26
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I should have elaborated like countries that aren’t in Europe
Benchamoneh@lemmy.dbzer0.com
on 18 Feb 2026 21:20
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But it is in Europe
Regrettable_incident@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 21:30
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Fuckin brexit.
fierysparrow89@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 20:12
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Off-topic, but…
it occurred to me the other day that Tesla (the actual person) has been exploited by Edison in real life. A century later his name is exploited yet again by another “genius inventor”. I just feel bad for the guy.
bitjunkie@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 20:27
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lol
Micocoule@sh.itjust.works
on 18 Feb 2026 20:32
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That’s awesome to read
Reygle@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 20:34
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Good. More please.
motruck@lemmy.zip
on 18 Feb 2026 20:43
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Musk fucked around and found out.
Regrettable_incident@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 21:26
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TBF I’m pretty sure that cheap Chinese EVs are a pretty big factor here. Of course, all the nazi shit doesn’t help.
LoafedBurrito@lemmy.world
on 18 Feb 2026 20:53
nextcollapse
I need articles like this to make me feel just a slight bit of joy with all the absolute insanity going on daily in the US.
phutatorius@lemmy.zip
on 21 Feb 2026 17:47
collapse
threaded - newest
We should get those numbers lower. Every Tesla is one too much.
Higher is better in this case. 100% preferably.
Well, I meant the number of sold cars. But yes, a 100% reduction would be great!
Trump could get them down 500% or even 700%
Innumeracy grants amazing powers, apparently.
Tja
I’m sure this had nothing to do with it, yeah? Fuck the PedoNazis and the Swasticar company.
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.zip/pictrs/image/9a8200b9-fd49-4928-9bc6-6c6f3f0f7777.gif">
In fairness, none of those countries liked the Romans, so…
And as the Visigoths ransacked Rome, Emperor Honorius was heard yelling, “not my Cybertruck!“
Ah, what a time to be alive: Pedo nazis are trying to take over the U.S. (and other parts of the world), and we‘re driving around in swasticars. Sounds like the plot of some 80‘s movie, but somehow it’s the reality we live in. And, somehow, where I live (central Europe), people are still voting for right-wing parties, seeing what is happening, seeing history repeating itself. This ignorance is infathomable to me, and I can only hope that either we will never suffer the consequences of what we‘re voting for or we learn it for real this time.
Alas, not sure about “trying”, but yes.
I am sure this is what Rubio meant when he said that they “need Europe to help save the West” the other day. Right?
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/5ff7044d-1be9-452c-b463-5ea65ea56a32.jpeg">
The FY2025 vs FY2024 numbers were plenty damning. Comparing January 2026 to previous Januaries is kinda silly given how much monthly fluctuation there is, and how few markets actually report on Monthly numbers
That’s a good start.
Look. I know Norway be cool in this, but I’m actually kind of shocked at just 93%.
Edit: Though, looking at the figures, makes sense. Business as usual if you don’t consider the one-off spike they’re comparing to to get that figured.
Yeah, the numbers for Norway are when the cars are registered, which happens when they arrive at the dealer. Since Tesla ships their cars in large batches, the numbers are difficult to compare.
I’m (unfortunately) certain that most of the decline in sales will disappear once the first big delivery of 2026 comes ashore.
Looking at 24 vs 25, numbers don’t lie
2024: 24,259 new Tesla cars registered in Norway. 2025: 34,285 new Tesla cars registered in Norway. bestsellingcarsblog.com/…/norway-full-year-2025-r…
So what is it for the year then?
If I’m reading your comment correctly, if they have no delivery that month… Their “sales” would be pretty much 0.
So why the fuck are we cherry picking numbers unrepresentative of reality? This is some right wing type of shit.
Oh that’s why:
2024: 24,259 new Tesla cars registered in Norway. 2025: 34,285 new Tesla cars registered in Norway.
bestsellingcarsblog.com/…/norway-full-year-2025-r…
Got no clue on reliability of the source, but there’s 3 on top of my search seem to line up.
IIRC tax reasons made it very much smarter to buy a Tesla in Dec 2025 than in Jan 2026. Norway has had a drop in sales, but stuff like this skews the numbers.
“Gonna buy a nazi mobile yet?”
“Nah, I have ethics.”
“They will be more expensive next year though”
Runs to the dealership
I think we underestimate how much the public cares… Reddit/Lemmy tend to be a very big echo chambers and we’ve seen several big events where online discource was completely at odds with reality. It still doesn’t explain how the increase. Because up until today, I believed Europe stopped buying them, but then the figures pedalled are fucking fake. Not sure how your place does it, but here the year of the car is on a reg plate… I see a lot of new teslas, far more than any other EV. I’ve seen couple of Renault 5s! Those are cool. But in the +40k mark? Just teslas. Despite allegedly MG making a Tesla killer a year ago, I’ve yet to see a single one.
The sentiment I see on various Facebook groups (dad Facebook) is that Tesla is still best value for money when it comes to EVs.
But yeah people bought cars in December because of tax reasons (basically 5k usd extra tax on cars above 50k)
I live in Norway and there’s a lot of Teslas here, but most people don’t buy a new one every year.
Any company with a functional board of directors would have fired the CEO yesterday.
This is not a legitimate business. Institutional investors should be running away from this company.
Don’t you know that Tesla will be building a Dyson Sphere together with SpaceX at a 100 Morbillion valuation? Who cares about cars?
They’re using their army of AI powered robots right?
Imagine where we’d be already if Nikola Tesla had his way.
Certainly not being hosed of all wealth, to enrich an oligarch, keeping us down, on the lie that the oligarch’s our saviour.
Dammit buy now. I missed the chance to buy a used teslas in California when the prices got really cheap.
Tesla global sales by year compared to Ford and Toyota
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/19d4910b-15d9-4a08-9aa3-97f174fb4fad.png">
The incredible thing isn’t the slight down tick in sales last year (on par with most international car companies), but that Tesla has a market cap that exceeds both of these mega-manufacturers despite being dwarfed in both assets and revenues.
On paper, they have so much farther to fall than what these short term sales shortfalls imply. But then this is a car company that’s defied gravity for a decade. Consider that each vehicle Tesla sells reflects $700k - $1M in market cap. On a $60k-$110k vehicle.
All their valuation is predicated on future predicted returns on the technology rather than current sales figures. And I don’t know when that will actually change.
It’s very clear that at this point, insofar as there is any logic at all to the decision making of people investing in Tesla (and there’s very little evidence of that), they’re evaluating it as a software company, not a car company.
This seems to be largely based on the notion that Tesla is the world leader in self-driving, and poised to become the world leader in other areas of automation. And that would, admittedly, mostly justify their very high share price, if there was literally any evidence it was true. Of course, what they actually have is a self-driving system that is only number one in fatalities caused, and a bunch of faked demos of robots made using low paid remote operators.
Tesla is easily the single best demonstration of how fucked our economic system really is. That a company can so blatantly lie, over and over, about what their products can actually do, and somehow continue to see their share price increase tells you everything you need to know about how utterly fictitious the entire notion of the stock market is.
That still doesn’t justify the valuation. Tesla’s market cap is 3x Oracle’s, ffs. It’s half of a Microsoft. No software they produce can justify this valuation.
Palantir and NVIDIA have the same hyper-inflated position. Nothing in their projected revenue figures can explain their company’s valuation, unless you’re just hand-waving and predicting 10-20x growth over the next decade.
Warren Buffet definitely gearing up to print off another deck of “Fell For It Again” awards. Only question is when they get handed out.
That’s exactly what they’re doing.
The problem is that hyper-advanced automation is essentially unpriceable. When your potential market penetration is “replace all human labour” your profit potential is infinite.
The real is issue is not how they’re pricing the potential upside, its that none of these companies have remotely demonstrated that they have the ability to actually produce that upside. It’s an entire industry shilling a fantasy on the back of some very impressive sales demos.
I mean, I could point you to a few economics journalists who would argue otherwise. Ed Zitron’s been screaming about the downfall of AI for the last two years straight.
But the market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent, as the saying goes.
Doesn’t hurt to have a bunch of tech-friendly goobers running state and federal governments who are turning out the taxpayer’s wallet to finance these hallucinations.
I feel like you’re only reading every other sentence of what I say. In this instance, you seem to have fixated on this part, but sailed right past the part where I said that there’s zero evidence that anyone can actually produce hyper-advanced automation. I never argued that it was a rational decision to go all in on this possibility, and that’s entirely clear from my previous comments.
Ed Zitron is completely correct, but he’s also making exactly the same argument I am; that these people cannot actually achieve the technological revolution they are promising. That doesn’t change the fact that, if their wish granting genie was real, it would basically have unlimited upside. The problem is not how they’re pricing the outcome, the problem is how they’re evaluating the probability of achieving the outcome.
There’s plenty of evidence (Waymo, for instance, or Xaiome) that companies can produce “good enough” advanced automation. Tesla’s just not the guy to make it happen. Same with AI. Very possible to produce useful tools (Alibaba’s Deepseek, Insilico Medicine’s Pharma.AI, etc) with LLMs. Sam Altman’s just not doing it.
Zitron’s heavily focused on the economics. Specifically, he’s fixated on the cost of running the American data centers relative to their prospective future revenues and profit horizons. He’s not even “anti-Tech” relatively speaking. He’s just reading balance sheets and doing basic math on depreciation rate of hardware to conclude the current business models won’t work.
This isn’t to say it can’t happen. It’s to say these businesses won’t make it happen.
This is where we’re in disagreement. They’re pricing their outcomes totally wrong, even in their self-proclaimed “best case scenario”. That’s leading them toward malinvestment - heavy spending on hardware and brute force algorithms. Marginal investment on material applications and workflow integrations that benefit anyone.
This isn’t a probability problem where they can luck into a multi-trillion dollar windfall.
Again, we’re still in that “reading every over sentence” mode. For example, I say “hyper-advanced automation” and you reply claiming that “Good enough” automation is perfectly achievable. Yes. I know. I never said it wasn’t. I never said anything about good enough automation at all. And that kind of thing goes on throughout your response here.
By all means continue your conversation with whoever you think is making all these arguments, but they bare little resemblance to anything I’m saying, so there’s really no point in my responding any further.
Here “Good enough” matches the quality of most car brands and AFAIK surpasses Tesla.
To get quality like BMW or Mercedes, is probably only a matter of the automation being more expensive, there is no reason to think for instance Xiaomi couldn’t make higher quality automated assembly on more expensive cars.
Tesla assembly sucks, I have often heard reviewers complain about noises you wouldn’t find in way cheaper European cars.
Kudos for mentioning Xiaomi, they recently showed off their newest car factory, and it’s insanely highly automated, with workers basically only doing quality control!
China is probably the new masters of mass production, which I suppose is natural considering they have a home market of 1.4 billion people, they can invest in mass production for China only, and have a scale that is 4 times the scale of USA!
No country has ever had such a massive home market before China, and I think it’s a huge advantage for China regarding mass production.
glances at India
But then that’s just the BRICS in a nutshell. Five countries with enormous internal consumer demand, which can afford to develop domestically to meet the needs of their local populations without worrying too much about export markets.
And has bigger population, but way lower economy.
With everything comparable like cars, China is now by far the biggest market in the world.
oica.net/sales-statistics/
China is twice what USA is, and 6 times India.
Just to be clear to those who might not get deeply into these things: Sam Altman is a salesman, and has no technical role within OpenAI. His job is to milk the VC tittie, to pump up the share price, to seek government subsidies, and to promise users the moon on a stick.
Another way of putting that is that, if for once, some of Elmo’s endlessly disproven hyperbole is in fact true, it’d have unlimited upside. So yeah, the chance of Tesla achieving a miracle is vanishingly slim.
Nah, the logic to the decision is that other people are buying a lot of tesla stock and the price keeps going up. It’s very nearly a ponzi scheme. It has value completely detached to what the company is doing. It’s tulips, crypto, beanie babies. Most institutional investors realizes this, they also are trying to get in and get out without holding the bag.
Remember WeWork? Lots of dumb people with money and if enough dumb people sustain their dumbness it doesn’t really matter. Stock goes up.
Boy howdy. You know Adam Neumann is still worth $2.2B?
Crazy how that happens.
Frustrating as hell. Losing a few mil means nothing to billions.
It’s honestly quite unhinged when you look at how much each vehicle contributes to their market cap.
What a beautiful way to present the situation.
Genuinely ~ i’d read his take on other issues!
So if sales are down 50% or more in Europe, where are these cars sold?
youtu.be/Ee_uujKuJMI
For starters, SpaceX, which operates the Starlink satellite network, has purchased over 1,000 Tesla Cybertrucks as of late 2025.
Meanwhile, Police departments across the U.S. - particularly in California - are increasingly adopting Tesla vehicles (Model Y, Model 3, and Cybertruck) for patrol and administrative use. South Pasadena (CA) became the first U.S. city to switch its entire police patrol fleet to electric vehicles. Other departments, including Anaheim and Fremont, are using Tesla Model Ys for patrol. The Las Vegas Metro Police Department is introducing a fleet of 10 Cybertrucks for patrol and tactical use, specifically highlighting their safety features (bullet-resistant). A Texas school district created it’s own police force to be equipped with 9 Tesla cruisers two years back.
The Model Y is the new Crown Vic.
It’s worth noting that SpaceX buying Tesla is Musk selling to Musk. Leaving that aside, there’s no demand for Cybertrucks except that which has been pumped up by Musk and by the rotten Trumpkin.
I wish that were true. But the Cult of Elon is strong. I see quite a few of them in Houston
Tesla stock price is a load of crap, pushed up solely by Elon chuds.
I think the 3 things Tesla has/had going for them was…
Car sales growth. The had some pretty ridiculous growth in sales for a few years there.
Captive Market. Pretty much everyone I know with a Tesla charges at home, or at a Tesla supercharger. They’ve got the Apple ecosystem lock in for the “fuel” you put in the car. This walled garden approach basically lets Apple print money.
Technology. FSD, autopilot, and manufacturing. Tesla presented as a very tech focused company that was dumping money into R&D similar to how Amazon built up in the early 2000s. Investors love companies that are poised to control the entire market in the future.
Pretty much all 3 of these pillars have collapsed now. Their car sales are in a huge global slump. More cars are available that can charge on other charging networks, and those charging networks get bigger and better every day. Elon’s FSD is basically vaporware at this point, and the high degree of automation Tesla was touting in their factories came back to bite them in the ass.
This leads to my favorite recent quote about stocks though… “The market can remain irrational longer than you can remain solvent.” Let’s face it, Tesla stock is a bubble, AI is a huge bubble. The problem isn’t knowing that there is a bubble, the problem is knowing when that bubble is going to burst.
One thing you’re missing is that about 1/3 of Tesla’s profits were from selling carbon credits to other manufacturers. That disappeared recently also.
What? How is possible that Ford is only 4x the global volume of Tesla? In my European country I see Ford everywhere while Teslas are a rare bird.
Maybe the Chinese sales are influencing those numbers? (Ford doesn’t sell as Ford in China but as a joint venture)
Apparently the numbers are real, even if in the Tesla numbers there are 600k for China.
Also, I didn’t notice that Ford nowadays only focuses on the premium market and sells way less units than 20 years ago, the Fords I’m seeing around are the cheaper fiesta and ka that are now discontinued
How many of those fords have been sold in only the past 2-3 years?
Hell, a lot of the “latest” models of ford (in terms of appearance) are as old as Tesla sales
I was biased by the big amount of the cheaper models that they used to sell until 2023. In the new car marketshare they crashed from 8% to 3% now that the cheapest option they’re offering is 30k instead of 15k
Maybe you just notice the Fords more because they’re all monster trucks these days.
I suspect many investors are betting that, in the near term at least, Trump will rig things in Musk’s favor. Don’t assume they only consider the traditional fundamentals of corporate valuation.
Textbook case of how to absolutely obliterate first-mover advantage. Pretty remarkable actually.
Tesla cars also fail the mandatory safety inspections in Europe at an alarming rate. That’s not a good look when buying a new car.
They’re also notoriously terrible build quality.
I will give Tesla credit for one solitary thing: They did help jumpstart electrics. Help. Not cause.
But that has been picked up by real car manufacturers, who just need more encouragement to continue to increase numbers, along with infrastructure projects to bring more charging stations to more places. A critical area would be for installations in places like apartment parking lots and various public parking lots (i.e. paid parking but I mean shopping lots)
Tesla is a scam and money laundering operation.
I took a tour of their factory in the mid-2010s because a friend worked there in their training and development department, he was in charge of everyone who wrote assembly guides/processes.
He told me they’ve always operated at a loss and relied on “shifty Elon” and that he’d never buy one but the money was great working there.
Nowadays I see so many incompetent Asian and Indian buffoons driving around the Bay Area in their Teslas, supporting this shit company and its wannabe Nazi CEO.
You can tell someone is incompetent because they’re Asian or Indian?.. Holy racism Batman!
No, the sentence is missing a comma. The incompetent driver part is the factual point of the observation. The casual mentioning of Asian and Indian is the racist part.
Review my response above and get back to me when you come to your senses.
No racism involved here. Just facts.
I did and laughed at it. Then I replied with actual facts to debunk your racist “facts.”
I see no reply whatsoever.
I love how you go straight to crying racism when it’s not that in the slightest. It’s simple math and factual information. Poor driving in those cultures is exceedingly common.
They do not often come from countries where there are proper traffic laws or where people actually obey whatever traffic laws there may be. They just go where they want when they want and good luck to you if you’re in the way. Go look at videos of driving in those countries and prove me wrong.
Where I live and work the population is 75+% Asian and Indian and they are the ones driving the overwhelming majority of the Teslas and literally asleep at the wheel or watching a movie or don’t care whatsoever who or what is around them on the road. They look at you like you’re crazy when you called them out on something terribly unsafe that they did on the road next to you in front of you or otherwise near you. They look at you like you’re crazy when you try to let them know that they don’t have any working brake lights - This is my favorite one I see all the time.
There are weekly or more than once per week posts on local subreddits and elsewhere about terrible driving here.
Nothing racist about it or me, it’s just facts. Those two videos I linked show you just a tiny sample of the nonsense we see here. Get off your goddamn high horse and don’t call me a racist.
I co-coach a little league team with Asian and Indian dads, work with many smart Asian and Indian people, I have nothing personally against these people, I’m just stating pure facts as it pertains to driving and Tesla ownership in this area.
Not sorry if you can’t handle that.
OK, let’s talk facts, since that is what you are using to justify your casual racism.
CA has a much larger population of Asian and Indian people than TX, with 17% Asian (including Indian) versus 6.4%. Based on your “factual” data, that would mean that CA should have more traffic accidents, right? Then why does TX have a 20% higher fatal accident rate than CA? Let’s say it is because they drive faster out there on the open roads than we do in crowded cities. Then why does TX have a 40% higher overall accident rate than CA? These are statistics adjusted by population, so it isn’t just because CA has a higher population. We drive in high traffic more often and should have more accidents. Yet we don’t.
OK, let’s just say TX is its own crazy ass world, since it is. Let’s look at Santa Clara County versus Los Angeles County. Both are high population cities with high Asian populations and mild weather. Santa Clara County is 43% Asian, while LA County is 16.4% Asian. Based on your “factual” analysis, we should expect a MUCH higher traffic accident rate in Santa Clara County. Then why does LA County have a 30% higher accident rate than Santa Clara County?
Look, it’s OK to be a little bit racist. We all are. Just recognize it and learn more about yourself and the world around you.
www.thehindu.com/news/…/article70361512.ece 485 people die per day on Indian roads, 177,000+ people a year, and a figure that is likely underreported given the stances of several international organizations such as the WHO.
…nic.in/…/Annual-Report-English-with-Cover.pdf Here is the data from India’s own govt agency overseeing Road Transport and Highways.
India also has a significant underreporting problem confirmed by multiple independent studies. Some suggesting that fatal accidents are as much as 40% under-reported tripc.iitd.ac.in/assets/…/RSI_2023_web.pdf
Conversely, the US suffers less than 40k traffic deaths per year, approximately 110 persons per day. crashstats.nhtsa.dot.gov/Api/Public/…/813729
…transportation.org/nhtsa-projects-decline-in-tra…
The US is a far more litigious society with more people reporting basic accidents vs in India as well.
LA county has a much higher accident rate because of far more population density and 8.2m vehicles vs Santa Clara’s 1.8m dmv.ca.gov/…/estimated_fee_paid_by_county_report.…
You can keep living in your fantasy world where you aren’t providing sources for your data. Come live here and experience it.
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/e82689da-94a7-4e8d-80ca-785523d6b98e.gif">
No worries! The stock price keeps going up, so it doesn’t matter how many cars Tesla actually sells.
Luckily most his real income is from the US government and consumers cannot impoverish this level headed and clear minded ketamine addict with their misguided purchasing decisions.
Oh dear. How sad. Never mind.
My heart goes out to Musk…
I wonder has that super genius figured out it was his fault yet? Just kidding he is a narcissist. They never blame themselves for their problems.
Thoughts and prayers 🙏
I see more BYDs in my country’s streets.
Yaaaaaay.
Does this mean we can get the real "Tesla"s soon?
Nikola Tesla style tech, not Tesla Corporation style tech. Emanipatory tech, not rentier tech. Spaceships for everybody, not cars and rockets for the rich enough.
No? It doesn’t mean that? Aw.
Stupid reality!
Their bubble is slowly leaking, and it will never inflate again. Tesla will be bankrupt in 3 years.
There are plenty of MAGA sheep, plus Teslas still seem to be super popular among the transplants from India in my area to keep the company around for a long time. SpaceX & Starlink have essentially no competition and Musk will just pivot.
Means that too many people are still buying teslas though.
My friend has one. When I saw her I asked if she knew there was dog shit on her drive. She came out and asked where. Wasn’t hapoy when I pointed at her tesla.
Attaboy, make her regret it every second you’re around
When she asked you if you think that was funny, did you reply with “heil no”?
Lol she didnt ask.
She just called me a dickhead
I’d like to see this article’s sources for the Norwegian sales number. Unfortunately, most other sources point to an about 40% increase in Tesla sales here last year. I generally like my country’s adoption of evs (I’m on my third), but the fact that the muskrat keeps selling cars in norway massively bugs me :/
IIRC that was because of the legislation change? Something about luxury vehicles thing stuff cheap thing change…projections are that it’ll crater this year? But I have zero sources, but that’s a starting point for a search, I guess. I’m about to start watching a gig so I’ll leave that someone better.
List of stuff that I can’t accept from a vehicle:
Well at point one, you’ve lost Volkswagen
Volkswagen also does subscription for heated seats
And lies about emissions.
Mercedes and BMW both worked for Hitler, even Porsche.
Ferdinand Porsche designed the original Volkswagen. There’s a very strong argument to be made that he was a Nazi.
Leon didn’t create it. He just bought the company. But for me, Nazi ownership is a bigger deal anyway.
how about on non-european countries is it the same?
The UK is a non-EU country.
:(
Norway as well.
I should have elaborated like countries that aren’t in Europe
But it is in Europe
Fuckin brexit.
Off-topic, but…
it occurred to me the other day that Tesla (the actual person) has been exploited by Edison in real life. A century later his name is exploited yet again by another “genius inventor”. I just feel bad for the guy.
lol
That’s awesome to read
Good. More please.
Musk fucked around and found out.
TBF I’m pretty sure that cheap Chinese EVs are a pretty big factor here. Of course, all the nazi shit doesn’t help.
I need articles like this to make me feel just a slight bit of joy with all the absolute insanity going on daily in the US.
UK must try harder.