This really feels like a huge opportunity for Canada. But I don’t know enough on this to argue for making a deal with China - or against it. This is all just spit balling and I’m ready to be set straight!
I mean I know Carney has come out against China on a number of things, calling them a geopolitical and foreign interference threat. I think he also mentioned their human rights record in the past. Does that change if we increase or decrease trade with them? I genuinely don’t know. Can we exert more influence over China if we work with them? Can they do the same to us? The timing of this particular announcement is interesting. It seems like they find PP more desirable than Carney…
When you look at progress in tech, science and space, China really looks to have a lot of momentum and is poised to take over leadership in these areas. I would hate for Canada to be left in the dust because we hitched ourselves too tightly to a collapsing America.
Maybe we can make an automotive deal with China that helps our own industry? Diversifying away from the US seems interesting.
It would certainly piss off Trump if we made some big trade deals with China.
cyberpunk007@lemmy.ca
on 24 Apr 03:47
nextcollapse
Agree with you, imagine USA buying Chinese stuff from Canadian companies 🤣
Maybe because logistics is such a complicated mess grok can’t process it?
non_burglar@lemmy.world
on 24 Apr 04:14
nextcollapse
It’s easy to cast this as an all-or-nothing kind of thing, but it is possible to make multilateral deals where everyone involved gets what they want. That’s why we want competent and trained people governing these transactions.
The only thing is negociation time. It takes a very long time to strike such accords and the political time in the US is very short.
Everything could be reversed tomorrow or in 2 years or never or be rereversed in 4…
Trade deals among stable countries usually account for longer lifespans to assure the market they can deploy and still benefit from it in 20 years.
It takes an especially long time with the EU as you need all 27 countries to accept it through each parliament and sometimes referendums and account for incoming countries. Any “no” is a veto of the whole accord. And you have to start all the negotiation from scratch.
They’re not worse than the US, but they’re not better either. Two dictators don’t make a democracy, and they never will. Having a choice between two dictators is not a great choice to begin with, and we shouldn’t feel forced to choose the lesser of two evils.
Besides, there is already a beautiful and relatively prosperous economic union on the other side of the Atlantic that almost perfectly aligns with our values. They need us right now, and we need them, and I think we would be absolutely foolish to prioritize anything else at this time.
JohnnyCanuck@lemmy.ca
on 24 Apr 06:02
nextcollapse
Yes, I absolutely think we should prioritize deals with the EU. I think this is the perfect time for it. I worry that it won’t be enough to make up for the US though and we’ll need other deals to make up the shortfall.
This european feels exactly the same way. Let us support each other even more than before, and if the dictators want deals they’ll have to accept our terms.
We all are already suffering the consequences of being majorly dependent to an economic world power. Not excited to depend on them ever again.
Business relations? Yes, if needed and to our benefit. Dependency? Nope.
LadyAutumn@lemmy.blahaj.zone
on 24 Apr 04:58
nextcollapse
A negotiated trade agreement with them would be huge going further into this trade war. It would make a massive difference for Canadians. Probably greatly help us over the recession. But, I definitely have questions about what it would look like.
That all being said, it’s probably bad optics for Carney right now. It’s probably in his interest to delay this until after the election.
That all being said, it’s probably bad optics for Carney right now. It’s probably in his interest to delay this until after the election.
Absolutely. The Chinese ambassador pretty much said that too by saying that Carney’s current stance is a posture for election… Basically giving Carney room to flip the other way after the election without China holding a grudge. At least, that’s how I read it.
Can we exert more influence over China if we work with them?
We thought the same thing back in the late 90s and early 00s. It didn’t work out very well for us. It gave them the economic and technological means to surveil their people and build up their military, while we benefited from cheap goods, but at the cost of losing our manufacturing base and electing someone who probably has serious brain damage. Who will now run our country into the ground.
All in all, I expect serious damage to our country, and China to go after Taiwan with their considerable military to grind up their young men, who have no chance of ever having a family after the one child policy screwed up their gender balance so badly.
If you have to hitch yourselves to another state, I recommend Europe over China.
threaded - newest
This really feels like a huge opportunity for Canada. But I don’t know enough on this to argue for making a deal with China - or against it. This is all just spit balling and I’m ready to be set straight!
I mean I know Carney has come out against China on a number of things, calling them a geopolitical and foreign interference threat. I think he also mentioned their human rights record in the past. Does that change if we increase or decrease trade with them? I genuinely don’t know. Can we exert more influence over China if we work with them? Can they do the same to us? The timing of this particular announcement is interesting. It seems like they find PP more desirable than Carney…
When you look at progress in tech, science and space, China really looks to have a lot of momentum and is poised to take over leadership in these areas. I would hate for Canada to be left in the dust because we hitched ourselves too tightly to a collapsing America.
Maybe we can make an automotive deal with China that helps our own industry? Diversifying away from the US seems interesting.
It would certainly piss off Trump if we made some big trade deals with China.
Agree with you, imagine USA buying Chinese stuff from Canadian companies 🤣
the admin said they will tariff countries who try to bypass this, but we havnt heard much over it.
Maybe because logistics is such a complicated mess grok can’t process it?
It’s easy to cast this as an all-or-nothing kind of thing, but it is possible to make multilateral deals where everyone involved gets what they want. That’s why we want competent and trained people governing these transactions.
The only thing is negociation time. It takes a very long time to strike such accords and the political time in the US is very short.
Everything could be reversed tomorrow or in 2 years or never or be rereversed in 4…
Trade deals among stable countries usually account for longer lifespans to assure the market they can deploy and still benefit from it in 20 years.
It takes an especially long time with the EU as you need all 27 countries to accept it through each parliament and sometimes referendums and account for incoming countries. Any “no” is a veto of the whole accord. And you have to start all the negotiation from scratch.
They’re not worse than the US, but they’re not better either. Two dictators don’t make a democracy, and they never will. Having a choice between two dictators is not a great choice to begin with, and we shouldn’t feel forced to choose the lesser of two evils.
Besides, there is already a beautiful and relatively prosperous economic union on the other side of the Atlantic that almost perfectly aligns with our values. They need us right now, and we need them, and I think we would be absolutely foolish to prioritize anything else at this time.
Yes, I absolutely think we should prioritize deals with the EU. I think this is the perfect time for it. I worry that it won’t be enough to make up for the US though and we’ll need other deals to make up the shortfall.
This european feels exactly the same way. Let us support each other even more than before, and if the dictators want deals they’ll have to accept our terms.
We all are already suffering the consequences of being majorly dependent to an economic world power. Not excited to depend on them ever again.
Business relations? Yes, if needed and to our benefit. Dependency? Nope.
A negotiated trade agreement with them would be huge going further into this trade war. It would make a massive difference for Canadians. Probably greatly help us over the recession. But, I definitely have questions about what it would look like.
That all being said, it’s probably bad optics for Carney right now. It’s probably in his interest to delay this until after the election.
Absolutely. The Chinese ambassador pretty much said that too by saying that Carney’s current stance is a posture for election… Basically giving Carney room to flip the other way after the election without China holding a grudge. At least, that’s how I read it.
We thought the same thing back in the late 90s and early 00s. It didn’t work out very well for us. It gave them the economic and technological means to surveil their people and build up their military, while we benefited from cheap goods, but at the cost of losing our manufacturing base and electing someone who probably has serious brain damage. Who will now run our country into the ground.
All in all, I expect serious damage to our country, and China to go after Taiwan with their considerable military to grind up their young men, who have no chance of ever having a family after the one child policy screwed up their gender balance so badly.
If you have to hitch yourselves to another state, I recommend Europe over China.