from Twoafros@lemmy.world to world@lemmy.world on 13 Sep 2024 06:52
https://lemmy.world/post/19716824
The article:
Boeing’s roughly 33,000 factory workers on the West Coast of the United States have voted overwhelmingly to strike in the latest blow for the beleaguered aircraft giant.
Machinists at the company’s factories in Seattle and Portland, Oregon on Thursday voted to walk off the job from midnight after rejecting management’s latest offer for better pay and conditions.
The International Association of Machinists and Aerospace Workers (IAM) said that 94.6 percent of its members voted to reject the contract and 96 percent backed a strike.
Boeing’s offer would have raised pay by 25 percent over four years, reduced workers’ share of healthcare costs and increased the company’s retirement contributions.
The aircraft maker’s offer also included a commitment to build its next aircraft at its facilities in greater Seattle after the company angered union members by moving production of the 787 Dreamliner to a non-unionised plant in South Carolina.
Workers had demanded a 40 percent wage rise, the restoration of a pension scheme that was axed a decade ago, and a stronger guarantee that future production would not be moved out of the Seattle region.
Jon Holden, IAM’s lead negotiator in the contract talks, said workers had spoken “loud and clear”.
“This is about respect, this is about addressing the past, and this is about fighting for our future,” Holden said.
“We strike at midnight.”
The strike, the first by Boeing workers since 2008, puts a halt to production of the best-selling 737 MAX and other aircraft as the company grapples with output delays, heavy financial losses and intense scrutiny of its safety record.
It also comes just weeks after new Boeing CEO Kelly Ortberg took the helm of the company with a pledge to “reset” the company’s relations with the union.
Ortberg had on Wednesday urged workers to vote against a strike, warning it would “put our shared recovery in jeopardy, further eroding trust with our customers and hurting our ability to determine our future together”.
Boeing did not respond immediately to a request for comment.
Adam Smith, a Democratic Party member of the House of Representatives representing Washington State, urged the two sides to return to the negotiating table.
“Across corporate America, so much of the wealth has wound up in the hands of so few people,” Smith said in a statement.
“Large corporations have increasingly prioritised their own profits and shareholders at the expense of workers. It is crucial that Boeing behaves as a responsible steward for its employees, so that every employee at their company is respected with fair wages and working conditions.”
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Solidarity. ✊
Wait. Isn’t 95% agreement statistically unlikely in basically any election?
Not when your company is fucking murdering whistleblowers, no.
Not when the voterbase has common interests.
This isn’t uncommon for labor votes, actually. Generally once a strike authorization vote comes up it’s already far past the point of supermajority. Unions don’t mess around.
You can say that if the voterbase is huge with multiple interest groups often at loggerheads to each other. But amongst people with predominantly similar interests such as in labour votes its is not that uncommon.
NINETY SIX PERCENT???
Bro how the hell did Boeing piss these guys off so much??? The closest my workplace ever got to a strike was when we literally didn’t get a raise one year during Covid, and that was 62% to strike. We were all pissed at the company over that one for obvious reasons, but this…
To me this result off the back of a 25% raise says one thing: This isn’t about pay. This was never about pay.EDIT: Nevermind! This is not a fucking 25% raise! This is a 6.25% raise every year for the next four years! This is NOT a 25% raise because of how it works in relation to inflation, and should NOT be treated as a 25% raise by anyone writing about it! It is presented as a 25% raise by Boeing solely to misinform and misdirect people! This is Boeing trying to wheedle their way out of paying their workers at rates above inflation ON TOP OF ALL THEIR EXISTING PROBLEMS!Combining that with what we know about the company’s culture of shutting down anyone with safety or wellbeing concerns in the name of faster cheaper production of aircraft…
That raise was only 6.25% per year in an age where prices are increasing more than that. It's not enough for a token raise anymore, people are seriously underpaid and executives are just outsiders that strip out the cash and give it to more outsiders.
For reference here are inflation rates YOY since 2017:
2017 2.10%
2018 1.90%
2019 2.30%
2020 1.40%
2021 7.00%
2022 6.50%
2023 3.40%
Just to make up for the last three years of inflation they would need +16.9% instantly. Assuming +2% inflation over those 4 years (which is the average but not right now) that means from 2020 to 2028 inflation rose 26.3% so if they started a +25% increase over 4 years this year, the workers would have the same spending power they had in 2020.
Data is from the bureau of labor statistics
That’s the reported inflation by the government markers, but be realistic with yourself.
Since 2017 food prices have gone up more like 65%, houses have gone up 50% (doubled since 2010), mortgage apr rates have tripled, rent has gone up 74%, and gas has gone up by 35%. Used cars and new cars have gone up 40% to 80% as well.
Tying “inflation” to those government markers and claiming that it keeps you at even pace (I’m not accusing you of this) with living is asinine. If you want to buy a house and a car today, you pretty much need to double what you were making in 2017.
Inflation is a basket of goods. Yes, you can pick out specific things that are rising faster than overall inflation, but people don’t buy just those.
There have been alternative means of measuring inflation, such as the old Billion Prices Project (stopped in 2016) or the Penn State ACY index:
sites.psu.edu/inflation/
In practice, they tend to track CPI fairly close.
What do we know about safety in their factories? Are those also held together by spit and duct tape?
You’re not wrong but 25% over 4 years isn’t going to even keep up with inflation if things keep going as they have. Our Union got 12% over two years for the upcoming contract and most of us aren’t happy about it. I know it’s better than most US workers are going to get but it’s not good enough.
OH FUCK I MISSED THAT IT WAS ONE OF THOSE SHITTY MULTI-YEAR CONTRACTS
Editing the original, those contracts are pure shit and a hot new favourite trick for employers to try and twist the narrative in their favour. That isn’t a 25% raise, that’s a 6.25% raise as well as an agreement that your future raises can’t be better.
Yeah, it would be hard to get a vote that the sky is blue by 96%.
#Union Strong!
Solidarity forever.
Boing needs to be nationalized.
Having worked for the government before, I think that’s a bad idea. A strong union and equitable compensation for labor are the best path forward.
Unless the unions are in charge the problem of the MBAs sending the company nosediving into the ground will remain in your scenario.
Ya because obviously the free market is doing so well for Boeing. We’ve (the tax payers) bailed out this company multiple times to the toon of billions and their planes are dropping out of the sky. Nah fam, if they are too big to fail but they can continue to fail when is enough?
Throwing enough money at a company to bail out out because they couldn’t manage themselves, getting nothing in return, and begging them to pwiddy pweeease not do it again rather than taking control of that strategic asset, and deleting its management is some impressive cuckoldry.
We need to nationalize the rail companies and oil companies as well.
And the banks. Incrementally easing into the housing market, and shifting company ownership to the workers sounds like a good idea - can’t have all the profits from workers’ labour being handed to lazy welfare queen shareholders.
A funded, exceptional government is needed. We should be treating these jobs as more than after-thoughts.
republiQans have been destroying it out loud, in earnest for fifty years
How about a strong union on top of nationalization?
There haven’t been real government employee unions since Reagan. They’re all kneecapped by law, and functionally can’t strike.
They allow themselves to be kneecapped by law imo
I’m sure in a good 20-30 years, when all the old fuckers holding jobs keel over at their desks, there might be more willpower to strike, but until then, not worth it for most people to risk one of the few ways to actually get fired from a federal job.
Edit: That or pay differential from private vs public sector gets large enough they can’t hire anybody. That seems more likely to me tbh.
oh hey cool another reason to think Reagan was a horrible fucking ghoul
I wonder if there have been any studies done on how this decision impacted ATC suicide rates.
EDIT: huh, well I'm not actually finding data on suicide rates among ATCs. I wonder if I'm repeating a myth? Or if it's just not well publicized or studied.
It’s entirely possible that data doesn’t exist… ALSO because of Reagan.
…wikipedia.org/…/Mental_Health_Systems_Act_of_198…
Our Boing
I had heard Boeing had offered a 25% pay bump. Hadn’t heard it was over 4 years. 6.25% per year wouldn’t keep up with (real) inflation if it keeps going like it has for the past several.
I’m a little sad the union didn’t have a quip about Boeing assassinating former employees.
Maybe it’s 25% over four years on top of regular yearly raises.
Maybe…
Yeah likely not.
It’s actually 5.75% annually.
6.25% would compund to 27.4% over 4 years.
Not to detract from your other points, but inflation has been reducing over the last year
Prices are still going up every time I go to the store. It’s nice for some think tank to say “inflation is down” but until I see prices stall out it’s just verbal masturbation.
Nobody claimed inflation had stopped (it never completely stops).
Reduced inflation means the prices are going up slower than they were.
There were also a bunch of things they were apparently losing under the deal; seems like articles keep not mentioning that.
33,000 people recognized that they were being shit on an said enough.
This will start conversations in many unions I imagine
The CEO and his management team created this, they did not take care of the workforce, and they cultivated the most recent reputational damage.
I thought they got a new CEO who was tasked with fixing the befuckedness the old CEO enshitted.
That’s what the article says.
Nothing will change. In late stage capitalism the only way to make the imaginary line go up is either to reduce quality or reduce pay. Maybe a too big to fail company that makes our aircrafts shouldn’t be profit motivated? The current state of Boeing is the inevitable outcome for all profit-based companies. No big deal when it’s Quiznos, but when is literally the only fish in its industry and vital to national security?
Soon, I assume, as parts run out, we’ll have parts being made by small shops in Ohio. Then we’ll see all sorts of cool things fall off into backyards!. Need a fancy turbo? No problem! It’s a gift from the sky’s! New aluminum roof? Coming right up!..er down actually.
Shit, I’ll be flying for Thanksgiving 🍽️🦃…I’ll see you if I see you! In your backyard!
Hopefully on an Airbus
That’s probably for the best…
Already saving lives.
That’s actually impressive. Boeing must really have been trying to rip them off lol.
From what I understand, the pension is one of the biggest concerns the union has. The method to vote its removal is scummy to say the least. Vote took place on Christmas break, where Boeing gives employees two weeks off with skeleton crew keeping the lights on, knowing no one would be there to vote against its repeal. They’ve been offered a 401k in return but want their pension back. That info comes from a 15 year employee part of the union but take it with a grain of salt.
Obviously there’s a ton of other issues ICs want to be addressed that don’t revolve around share prices. This is just one I keep hearing and the feelings of betrayal and resentment are palpable when I hear someone talk about it. They also complain about the union leader who uses his friend lawyer to negotiate against a team of corporate lawyers but that’s heresay.
Boeing killed John Barnett
This is the exact same thing that brought them to where they are. I trust the direction of the company more now that they’re striking than I would if they had agreed to a temporary deal so they can kick the proverbial can down the road till some arbitrary future date.
Funny how it’s always “Now is not a good time to strike” and never “Now is not a good time to avoid working with the union”
Lol wtf is Boeing thinking? They’re in the middle of the biggest PR nightmare in the history of the company, and then they let negotiations fail with the union. YOU CANNOT AFFORD TO PAUSE ANY PRODUCTION RIGHT NOW!
There was only one logical option; give the union whatever they asked for, stay out of the news, and keep the whole thing quiet, which would have probably turned into a big PR win too. Completely idiotic corporate policy on every level.
Thinking about it, it might actually be beneficial. There’s a number of orders that were put on hold due to the MAX clusterfuck.
Take the time to go through the production line with a fine toothed comb. Or better yet, burn the whole thing down and start from scratch.
They should bring down the entire company and acquire it for the workers. That’d help both them and the consumers.
Would this endanger national security? I was going to say so, but I’m not sure about the details.
Or what, they’ll go out of business? They’re essential for defense and the economy, too big to fail.
They’re betting on getting bailed out and outlasting the strike. For that, it’s perfect timing to deny the union a deal.
Boeings that don’t get built are safer.
From what I’ve heard, Boeing weapons that don’t get built are even safer!
Kinda insane. Thought that Boeing was one of those companies too big to fall. Maybe it still is, since it has it’s hands in so many fields (military, government, space, etc), but it’s looking more and more plausible.
It’s always “To big to fail”, until it fails.
They are saving lives by not building those flying death traps.
If we gave Boeing MORE Taxpayer Money they would be ABLE to Give Their Workers More Money! It’s OUR Fault for using Taxdollars to Feed BROWN KIDS instead of BOEINGS CEOS kids!
Well, they wont be misassembling anymore planes or spacecraft at least