Framework stops selling separate DDR5 RAM modules to fight scalpers (www.pcworld.com)
from tal@lemmy.today to selfhosted@lemmy.world on 28 Nov 03:22
https://lemmy.today/post/42579857

#selfhosted

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Dirk@lemmy.ml on 28 Nov 03:26 next collapse

Someone else will continue selling RAM and making money.

tal@lemmy.today on 28 Nov 03:28 next collapse

I remember when it wasn’t uncommon to buy a prebuilt system and then immediately upgrade its memory with third party DIMMs to avoid paying the PC manufacturer’s premium on memory. Seeing that price relationship becoming inverted is a little bonkers. Though IIRC Framework’s memory-on-prebuilt-systems didn’t have much of a premium.

I also wonder if it will push the market further towards systems with soldered memory or on-core memory.

monkeyman512@lemmy.world on 28 Nov 03:48 next collapse

I don’t see how it would push manufacturers to do that. I can see how it would make consumers more open to soldered RAM if RAM is so expensive there is no way you are going to upgrade it later. But, I would be interested to get your thoughts as I miss stuff that feels obvious I’m hindsight all the time.

tal@lemmy.today on 28 Nov 04:06 collapse

If consumers aren’t going to or are much less likely to upgrade, then that affects demand from them, and one would expect manufacturers to follow what consumers demand.

cmnybo@discuss.tchncs.de on 28 Nov 04:37 collapse

RAM prices will come down sometime after the AI bubble bursts and they start making more DDR5 again.

NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip on 28 Nov 04:46 collapse
  1. Prices rarely, if ever, go down in a meaningful degree. Stuff like this is partially necessity and partially a REALLY good excuse to see what the price ceiling actually is… and then turn that into the floor moving forward. Just look at gas prices
  2. The “AI Bubble” is likely to be on the same level as the Dotcom Bubble and the like. It is going to be brutal and a LOT of people are going to lose their jobs… and then much of the same tech will still dominate just with more realistic expectations. And that will still need large amounts of memory
  3. If the “AI Bubble” really is as bad as people seem to want it to be: A LOT of the vendors who make the parts you are buying RAM to use are going to be gutted. And then RAM production will drop drastically. Which will decrease supply and…
tal@lemmy.today on 28 Nov 05:47 next collapse

Prices rarely, if ever, go down in a meaningful degree.

Prices on memory have virtually always gone down, and at a rapid pace.

ourworldindata.org/…/historical-cost-of-computer-…

<img alt="1000009320" src="https://lemmy.today/pictrs/image/b309e30f-59b2-4ef6-9b00-bacf30c13af1.jpeg">

eskuero@lemmy.fromshado.ws on 28 Nov 10:42 next collapse

people say go back in time to pick the correct lotto number

I say go back in time and sell my 8TB disk for 80 billion

Goodlucksil@lemmy.dbzer0.com on 28 Nov 18:14 collapse

Well, no. Computers until recently (2000s or so) were incompatible with modern protocols required for that much memory.

eskuero@lemmy.fromshado.ws on 28 Nov 19:32 collapse

Bring back my computer as well

NuXCOM_90Percent@lemmy.zip on 28 Nov 15:38 collapse

What you are describing is something different… that is “close enough” to Moore’s Law for all but the most pedantic.

The (I forget the proper economics term so) base price of RAM/Storage does indeed go down as new processes and economies of scale are developed. But the cost of a “laptop hard drive” remains pretty steady in the sense that a couple hundred MB was enough back in the day but you REALLY want at least 500 gigs now. The price per byte does indeed drop rapidly but the price per “drive” is far more stable (not fully stable due to inflation and how many people are buying them, but within spitting distance).

Its why a good rule of thumb was to always just spend roughly the same on storage during an upgrade and that would result in faster technologies and larger capacity drives and so forth.

That isn’t what is happening with RAM in 2025. A much better comparison is GPUs because… it is the same problem. It is ridiculously high demand from businesses (often startups pouring dump trucks of VC money into their only hope… well, VC money or drug money in the case of miners but they matter a lot less these days) driving this. A quick search didn’t yield an easy graph and I can’t be bothered to go dig through Gamers Nexus’s twelve videos on it, but the price of an “entry level” GPU has drastically changed in the past decade.

But just for two-ish data points?

  • The GTX 980 and 970 had an MSRP (probably) of 550 and 330 USD, respectively, back in 2014
  • While there is some other bullshit involved, the RTX 5080 and 5070 have MSRPs of 1000 USD and 550 USD in 2025
  • Adjusting for inflation, the 980 and 970 would still only be about 753 and 451 USD in 2025 dollars
  • And let’s not forget that basically no cards were sold at MSRP back in early 2025…

The last point being what is, by all accounts, going to be the new normal. Barring outside impacts like… RAM going through the roof. Vendors will sell the cards for the ACTUAL MSRP rather than the inflated demand prices. And they will still be considerably more expensive as a result.

All of which is to say… my current card is definitely good enough but having a hard time deciding if I do one “final” upgrade for the decade. But I am an AMD boi so those are at least “reasonable” in terms of price per performance.

dan@upvote.au on 28 Nov 07:10 next collapse

Prices rarely, if ever, go down in a meaningful degree.

In 2011, there was a large flood in Thailand that impacted ~40% of hard drive manufacturing. As a result, hard drives significantly increased in price. This was back when SSDs weren’t mainstream yet.

A year or two later, when manufacturing capacity was restored, prices were essentially back to what they were before the disruption.

Apart from disruptions like that, HDDs, SSDs, and RAM have always been going down in price.

Diplomjodler3@lemmy.world on 28 Nov 09:51 next collapse

In 1995 I bought 4 MB of RAM for DM 200, which, adjusted for inflation probably works out to about €200 in today’s money. I’d say, prices have come down quite a bit, since.

irmadlad@lemmy.world on 29 Nov 14:45 collapse

Pretty much…after the dust all settles and the crying stops, life goes on without you. That’s reality.

istdaslol@feddit.org on 28 Nov 07:44 next collapse

It’s kinda crazy. Got myself a new thinkpad and the 2nd 32GB stick would cost another 150 bucks. Didn’t knew that retail they are now at above 200 xD

djdarren@piefed.social on 28 Nov 07:47 next collapse

I’ll never forget buying my first MacBook in ’07 and asking the guy how much it would cost to bump the RAM from 1Gb to 2Gb. He told me in no uncertain terms that I’d be better off looking online for a cheaper price.

Well, in the intervening years they certainly have closed that loophole.

wavebeam@lemmy.world on 28 Nov 17:53 collapse

I worked at a knock-off Apple Store in the PNW from 2009 to 2013 and I told this same line to MANY people. The thing about being an “Apple Specialist” is that we sold more than Apple did, including “aftermarket” RAM modules to do that upgrade on-site for customers, saving those customer money AND netting us more profit than if we had sold them the Apple SKU with more RAM. When Apple closed this loophole it was not just at the expense of end-users, but their channel partners too.

djdarren@piefed.social on 29 Nov 12:45 collapse

Yeah, I ended up dropping 4Gb in that one. For some reason it could only see 3Gb, but it made it immensely more useful. It got me through a radio production degree and only got replaced because I happened to find myself in a position to be able to afford a 13” Pro a few years later. In fact, it’s still in a box somewhere.

SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world on 28 Nov 10:30 next collapse

The Framework desktop already has soldered ram. That’s because AMD only sells that CPU like that.

artyom@piefed.social on 28 Nov 13:17 next collapse

I remember when OEMs just didn’t rape you on RAM and storage.

pirateKaiser@sh.itjust.works on 28 Nov 17:32 collapse

Except for Alienware

RickyRigatoni@retrolemmy.com on 29 Nov 15:01 collapse

well aliens are known for violating people so it’s on brand for them

anomnom@sh.itjust.works on 28 Nov 18:46 collapse

Yeah I miss the days of buying a mid spec MacBook and then immediately doubling or quadrupling the ram with Corsair or similar 3rd party ram.

Getting swap memory off those old HDDs was such a performance boost. Then later adding SSDs was another huge boost.

BroBot9000@lemmy.world on 28 Nov 03:33 next collapse

Framework still have their “big tent” Nazi problem?

tehmics@lemmy.world on 28 Nov 03:59 next collapse

Their what now

SatyrSack@quokk.au on 28 Nov 04:18 collapse

They want everyone to buy their products, and have no problem with those who want us all dead

https://community.frame.work/t/framework-supporting-far-right-racists/75986

drdiddlybadger@pawb.social on 28 Nov 05:39 next collapse

Yeeeeeaaaaaah I don’t think I can do business with folk who aren’t clear about that sort of thing either. Not when there are other Linux centric builders you can support.

sorrybookbroke@sh.itjust.works on 28 Nov 07:01 next collapse

Tuxedo computers and slimbook ship great Linux laptops btw

SkunkWorkz@lemmy.world on 28 Nov 10:42 next collapse

Holy Fuck didn’t know that DHH is a straight up Nazi. I always thought he was nothing more than a dumb autistic libertarian, guess that black and white thinking some people on the spectrum have pushes them far right.

lka1988@sh.itjust.works on 28 Nov 17:22 next collapse

Yo wtf

fuckwit_mcbumcrumble@lemmy.dbzer0.com on 28 Nov 20:36 collapse

Really?!? The company that LTT has invested in might also support some problematic people?

voicesarefree@lemmy.world on 28 Nov 04:25 collapse

I missed all of this, but mostly caught up now. Hopefully Feamework starts making some better decisions on who they align with.

SystemL@literature.cafe on 28 Nov 08:04 collapse

Scalpers ruin everything…

raman_klogius@ani.social on 28 Nov 08:16 collapse

Scalpers should be scalped, in the original sense of the word

Blackmist@feddit.uk on 28 Nov 10:05 collapse

That would be scalpees.