Why is it called "overseas" even if a dispora population move to a place connected by land?
from DeathByBigSad@sh.itjust.works to nostupidquestions@lemmy.world on 07 Nov 2025 15:54
https://sh.itjust.works/post/49374271

See example: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overseas_Chinese

China is connected by land to Europe. So… Is a Chinese National moving to France technically “overseas”? I mean technically you could tavel by land there?

🤔🤔🤔

the dictionary is a lie…

#nostupidquestions

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xiao@sh.itjust.works on 07 Nov 2025 16:08 next collapse

I think the term “Chinese diaspora” is more appropriate.

edit : What I mean is that this word (overseas) no longer necessarily reflects today’s reality; it should be obsolete, like many other words nowadays. Languages are alive.

MelastSB@sh.itjust.works on 07 Nov 2025 16:47 collapse

It’s only a diaspora if it comes from the diaspora region of the Middle-East. Otherwise it’s just sparkling migration

xiao@sh.itjust.works on 08 Nov 2025 05:21 collapse

Yes, originally, but the words are also used in their extended meaning.

piyuv@lemmy.world on 07 Nov 2025 16:09 next collapse

Language is a living thing, it evolves as time progresses.

“Oversea” is currently synonymous with “abroad”. When it was first came to use, geography wasn’t as much advanced as it is today.

See en.wiktionary.org/wiki/oversea

AbouBenAdhem@lemmy.world on 07 Nov 2025 16:13 next collapse

Before trains, sea travel was the standard way to travel long distances even if a land route was available. Sea voyages came to represent any destination that was far enough away that communities wouldn’t be in regular contact.

litchralee@sh.itjust.works on 07 Nov 2025 16:23 next collapse

A few factors:

  • Human population centers historically were built by natural waterways and/or by the sea, to enable access to trade, seafood, and obviously, water for drinking and agriculture
  • When the fastest mode of land transport is a horse (ie no railways or automobiles), the long-distance roads between nations which existed up to the 1700s were generally unimproved and dangerous, both from the risk of breakdown but also highway robbery. Short-distance roads made for excellent invasion routes for an army, and so those tended to fall under control of the same nation.
  • Water transport was (and still is) capable of moving large quantities of tonnage, and so was the predominant form of trade, only seeing competition when land transport improved and air transport was introduced.

So going back centuries when all the “local” roads are still within the same country (due to conquest), and all the long-distance roads were treacherous, slow, and usually uncomfortable (ie dysentery on the Oregon Trail), the most obvious way to get to another country would have been to get a ride on a trading ship. An island nation would certainly regard all other countries as being “overseas”, but so would an insular nation hemmed in by mountains but sitting directly on the sea. When land transport is limited, sea routes are the next best. And whereas roads only connect places situated along the route, the sea (and the sky) allow point-to-point trading, exposing faraway countries to each other when their ships arrive at the port.

TL;DR: for most of human history, other countries were most reasonably reached by sea. Hence “overseas”.

imsufferableninja@sh.itjust.works on 07 Nov 2025 16:53 next collapse

Why do you drive on a parkway and park on a driveway.

MyTurtleSwimsUpsideDown@fedia.io on 07 Nov 2025 18:06 next collapse

The word goes back to at least 1580 and at that time, and for a good while thereafter, the most prominent speakers of the English language lived in a kingdom on a small island in Northern Europe that they shared with only one other nation until the two joined into one. So for a good chunk of history and during the development of modern English, most travel between “home” and a foreign land required going over seas. Thus “overseas” took on a meaning of foreigness or awayness.

FriendOfDeSoto@startrek.website on 07 Nov 2025 18:29 collapse

[Angry Welsh noise, probably involving a lot of consonants and a few double L’s]

MyTurtleSwimsUpsideDown@fedia.io on 07 Nov 2025 18:35 collapse

Don’t blame me. Blame the English. I looked it up before posting: the Kingdom of England had annexed Wales by 1536.

FriendOfDeSoto@startrek.website on 07 Nov 2025 22:59 collapse

Does a nation cease to exist after it is conquered? All the efforts to that effect by the English notwithstanding, it’s still there.

MyTurtleSwimsUpsideDown@fedia.io on 07 Nov 2025 23:42 collapse

I did not intend to imply that it did. That’s why I said “one other nation” apart from the kingdom, since the nation of Wales was incorporated into the Kingdom at the time.

I suppose with “until the two nations joined” I did accidentally classify the Kingdom of England as a single nation. My sincerest apologies. I have corrected the error.

FriendOfDeSoto@startrek.website on 08 Nov 2025 02:30 collapse

Not to worry! And thank you for this civilized exchange that managed to stay clear of Godwin’s Law:)

FreedomAdvocate@lemmy.net.au on 08 Nov 2025 04:19 collapse

It’s ……not.