Should we consider Jesus a zombie?
from TehBamski@lemmy.world to nostupidquestions@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 20:05
https://lemmy.world/post/18730376

I mean they say he raised from the dead and all.

#nostupidquestions

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bjoern_tantau@swg-empire.de on 16 Aug 2024 20:07 next collapse

Yes.

Varyk@sh.itjust.works on 16 Aug 2024 20:08 next collapse

yup.

and every Christian who takes communion is a cannibal.

some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org on 16 Aug 2024 20:57 collapse

That’s Catholics.

erusuoyera@sh.itjust.works on 16 Aug 2024 21:08 next collapse

Who are Christians.

DontTreadOnBigfoot@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 21:20 next collapse

But only the Catholics believe in transubstantiation, so only they are cannibals because only they believe that they are literally eating his body

All other Christians see communion as symbolic, and therefore are not cannibals.

Reverendender@sh.itjust.works on 16 Aug 2024 22:01 next collapse

The only way to solve this is violent bloody war

tacosplease@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 23:00 collapse

You really just need one Catholic for a post communion dissection.

Burninator05@lemmy.world on 17 Aug 2024 16:23 collapse

A sample size one? That’s hardly enough for a conclusive result. The one you dissect could have just been a cannibal anyway and while corrupt the findings. Really a brutal war is the only way to go if we want enough samples.

Jarix@lemmy.world on 17 Aug 2024 20:36 collapse

Well symbolic cannibals

some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org on 16 Aug 2024 22:42 next collapse

Sure, but I was pointing out that not all christians, just the ones on that team.

Steve@communick.news on 16 Aug 2024 22:51 collapse

A point of debate for many Christians.

DemBoSain@midwest.social on 16 Aug 2024 22:54 next collapse

Are Lutherans catholic? I went to church a few times with my cousins years and years ago, and they were Lutheran. I snagged communion with them once, my aunt was so mad…

adespoton@lemmy.ca on 16 Aug 2024 23:13 next collapse

Lutherans would consider themselves Catholic for the most part; Roman Catholics would not.

Catholic just means “universal” though… at least when it’s lower case. Which is why most denominations will recite the creed and say they believe in the catholic church — which is a totally different thing from the Roman Catholic Church.

Deconceptualist@lemm.ee on 16 Aug 2024 23:26 collapse

Umm I thought Martin Luther was like, the original protestant.

adespoton@lemmy.ca on 16 Aug 2024 23:30 collapse

Yeah; he was also a Catholic. He wasn’t protesting against the Catholic Church, he was protesting against the corruption within the church. He was a reformer, not a detractor.

Deconceptualist@lemm.ee on 17 Aug 2024 01:52 collapse

Oh, I re-read your previous comment and understand better now. It’s been a long while since I learned this stuff.

some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org on 17 Aug 2024 00:49 collapse

Lutherans too? Damn, that’s wild. I completely misspoke out of ignorance. I thought it was well-known and established that it was a catholic thing alone.

DeltaTangoLima@reddrefuge.com on 17 Aug 2024 00:12 collapse

No, it’s not just Catholics who take communion.

Source: Mum tried to raise me Anglican.

some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org on 17 Aug 2024 00:47 collapse

Really? That’s new information to me! Wow, just when you thought you knew a thing you find out you don’t. Are there any others that do the transubstantiating crackers?

DeltaTangoLima@reddrefuge.com on 17 Aug 2024 01:47 collapse

Honestly, I’m not sure. You might still be partly right, though.

The Anglican church originated from the Church of England which was created by (the formerly Catholic) Henry VIII, when the Pope wouldn’t annul his marriage to Catherine of Aragon.

Just evidence, as always, of religion being used to further a powerful person’s agenda.

AreaKode@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 20:14 next collapse

Technically, he would be a lich.

FaceDeer@fedia.io on 16 Aug 2024 21:17 collapse

Nah, a lich is a wizard who returns to life by binding his soul to a phylactery. Jesus was a cleric, so he came back as a mummy lord.

adespoton@lemmy.ca on 16 Aug 2024 23:15 collapse

Except he famously left the linen folded up in the tomb and had all his body parts intact….

metostopholes@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 20:14 next collapse

<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/3c8fc874-099c-4518-a6ba-6746d92f3c1d.jpeg">

Kolanaki@yiffit.net on 16 Aug 2024 20:25 next collapse

So is the Spear of Destiny his phylactery?

Fondots@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 21:50 next collapse

Holy Grail feels more apt, vessel filled with his semi-literal blood sound phylactery-ish to me

Exusia@lemmy.world on 17 Aug 2024 01:25 collapse

And Liches hide them very well. No one’s ever found the holy Grail, so this tracks

Thavron@lemmy.ca on 17 Aug 2024 19:55 collapse

What do condoms have to do with anything?

Steve@communick.news on 16 Aug 2024 22:50 next collapse

Classic Vodo zombies weren’t mindless eaters of brains.

They were fully cognizant people raised to carry out someone’s will.

That could apply.

s1ndr0m3@lemmy.world on 17 Aug 2024 01:02 next collapse

Jesus raised Lazarus from the dead. So does that mean he was a lich before the crucifixion?

huginn@feddit.it on 17 Aug 2024 01:17 next collapse

Gotta be a lich before you die or else you don’t come back

JackbyDev@programming.dev on 17 Aug 2024 02:45 collapse

Oooh, good point.

skulblaka@sh.itjust.works on 17 Aug 2024 01:37 collapse

He was a high level cleric, obviously.

JackbyDev@programming.dev on 17 Aug 2024 02:45 next collapse

Where phylactery?

VindictiveJudge@lemmy.world on 17 Aug 2024 04:29 next collapse

He’s clearly a divine soul sorcerer who went to zero HP one session, then remembered he had Unearthly Recovery the next session but had already rolled a new character.

MindTraveller@lemmy.ca on 17 Aug 2024 05:47 collapse

Fake news. Jesus was a Revenant.

tigeruppercut@lemmy.zip on 17 Aug 2024 06:22 collapse

Jesus went to hell and came back. He looks nothing like a hell revenant. Way fewer missiles, for one thing

<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.zip/pictrs/image/589192d3-e400-48bd-bc01-9e51e9b79eb4.webp">

AbouBenAdhem@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 20:23 next collapse

According to the Wikipedia article on West African Vodun:

Many vodúnsɛntó practice their traditional religion alongside Christianity, for instance by interpreting Jesus Christ as a vodún. […] The possessed person is often referred to as the vodún itself.

Phenomephrene@thebrainbin.org on 16 Aug 2024 20:24 next collapse

No.

I'm in the camp that believes that Jesus was a real person. And being that he was a real person, he did not rise from the dead, because that doesn't happen. So, Jesus was not a zombie.

If Jesus wasn't actually a real person... sure, knock yourself out. Zombie, Lich, whatever else you want to call it. Doesn't really matter if we're just making up stories with no real historical basis.

[deleted] on 16 Aug 2024 20:34 collapse
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Phenomephrene@thebrainbin.org on 16 Aug 2024 20:39 collapse

Aww, and here I thought I was contributing to a discussion. I'll leave you alone now since I ruin your fun. Hopefully you can feel free to be a bit more lighthearted in my absence.

DoctorButts@kbin.melroy.org on 16 Aug 2024 20:30 next collapse

Follow up question: if he was a zombie, would you marry him?

meco03211@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 20:36 collapse

heavy Tina moaning

some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org on 16 Aug 2024 20:57 next collapse

When I was in college I wanted to make a short film with Jesus as a fuckup: raises Lazarus as a zombie by mistake, needs little kids’ floaty arm things on ankles to walk on water, apostles only hang out with him for the free wine. Never got around to it.

ComicalMayhem@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 21:10 collapse

you should do it now.

some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org on 16 Aug 2024 22:42 collapse

I’ve lost interest.

MeThisGuy@feddit.nl on 16 Aug 2024 22:53 collapse

passion of the Christ 2: Jesaloo

some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org on 17 Aug 2024 00:50 collapse

Only if Charlie agrees to play Jesus.

lord_ryvan@ttrpg.network on 17 Aug 2024 07:18 collapse

Charlie Sheen? He might, you should ask.

Donjuanme@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 21:00 next collapse

Jesus was a hovercraft.

Magic Woody Allen zombie super hero komodo dragon telepathic quantum hovercraft Jesus.

[deleted] on 16 Aug 2024 21:09 next collapse
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sp3tr4l@lemmy.zip on 16 Aug 2024 21:50 next collapse

Assuming Jesus was a normal human being, one of many wandering apocalyptic Jewish preachers of the era… no, he’s just a dead cult leader who became legendary following exaggerated stories about him becoming popular after his death.

Assuming you attempt to take any of these stories seriously, it depends on your interpretation and which stories you believe hold precedence over others.

Paul seems to refer to Jesus as having a glorified spiritual/phantom kind of body, which evidently looks like a person but is capable of flying and either teleporting or phasing through walls. Paul never actually refers to a physical/fleshy Jesus, Jesus is always seen in visions, or encounters which can be read as fleeting appearances of basically a glorious or mysterious ghost, or more sceptically as hallucinations.

Marcion and his followers embraced these ideas over the later Gospels, and rejected the idea that Jesus had been crucified, that he was physical/flesh whatsoever.

The Gospels however, refer to Jesus very much having a human body, with holes from his crucifixion, (the doubting Thomas story), who eats and sleeps. so this is more in line with a zombie or lich.

But, there’s also Jesus’ slew of powers/miracles that basically make him into a conjuration capable mage, a healing capable cleric, a necromancer, who raises the dead, a summoner of spirits (the transfiguration, Moses and Elijah come down from Heaven), and whatever kind of mage type spell is needed to either vanish or fly off into heaven.

(Also I guess partly Bard as well, if you count telling parables as a Bardly skill)

So basically he’s a custom or multi or hybrid class going by different kinds of TTRPG rules… ???

The entities that were almost certainly zombies were all of the dead who rose from their graves upon the moment of Jesus death in Matthew 27 51-53.

They then waited around the cemetery for the three days it took for Jesus to be resurrected, and then wandered around Jerusalem and ‘were seen by many’.

Where they went afterward is unclear, they are never again mentioned.

The nature of Jesus physical form vs spiritual form was part of considerable contention amongst early Christians: Was Jesus God incarnated as a human, or was he a human Messiah blessed by God… or… both?

Eventually the concept of the Trinity was decided on, but this was after several hundred years of competing sects and stories and texts.

Early Christian sects varied wildly on … basically everything, from whether or not the old Jewish law and customs needed to be adhered to, to which stories about Jesus were true and which were false…

The Essenes believed that Jesus was a 96 foot tall demi-god/angelic being and that he had a sister, the Holy Spirit, who was female, and also a 96 foot tall demi-god/angel.

The Cerinthians, the Valentinians and the Sethians seemed to all follow a line of thought which eventually became the Gospel of Judas, which proposes that Yahweh is actually Yaldabaoth, an evil demiurge amongst a pantheon of other gods, who created this world and all material existence as a kind of prison, and that Jesus was actually ‘from the immortal realm of Barbelo’, come to reveal to us mortals a path to basically escaping the matrix through the enlightenment of learning this and other hidden truths.

(I use ‘escaping the matrix’ deliberately as the Wachowskis themselves incorporated Gnostic ideas into the movies, as well as concepts from many other religions and philosophers)

So this Jesus would be less like a zombie and be more like Neo getting up after being shot by Smith: Jesus is but a man, he is a physical incarnation in a world with physical rules, but he can sometimes bend or break these rules.

His true essence, his Spirit, is a separate entity that is elsewhere, in another realm of existence, and that spirit is basically just piloting the human form ‘Jesus’ as one directs a virtual avatar to move around in a video game.

There were and currently are so many different sects of Christianity that uh, basically, Jesus is whatever is determined by whichever canon and theology you accept.

daddy32@lemmy.world on 18 Aug 2024 06:57 collapse

Thanks for the read.

SnotFlickerman@lemmy.blahaj.zone on 16 Aug 2024 22:10 next collapse

He was Jewish, so a Golem might be a better cultural fit, but I’m pretty sure Jesus was (according to the fairy tale) born to a human woman and not made of mud.

meeeeetch@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 22:51 collapse

Adam was a golem

db2@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 23:44 collapse

Gottlem

DeathsEmbrace@lemmy.ml on 16 Aug 2024 22:11 next collapse

But he doesn’t want brain (˵ ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°˵).

numberfour002@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 23:28 next collapse

He’s a bitch. He’s a lover. He’s a child. He’s a zombie. He’s a sinner. He’s a saint.

db2@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 23:43 next collapse

Maurice?

Supervisor194@lemmy.world on 17 Aug 2024 02:07 next collapse

He’s a dream divine and we make love together 🎶

No_Eponym@lemmy.ca on 17 Aug 2024 08:29 collapse

He do not feel ashamed!

Kyrgizion@lemmy.world on 16 Aug 2024 23:49 next collapse

I suppose technically he’s more of a revenant. Higher hit dice.

Brutticus@lemm.ee on 17 Aug 2024 02:08 next collapse

is santa an elf?

JackbyDev@programming.dev on 17 Aug 2024 02:43 collapse

Depends on the universe. The Santa Clause? Explicitly human.

tiefling@lemmy.blahaj.zone on 17 Aug 2024 07:23 next collapse

Jesus was a zombie

frankPodmore@slrpnk.net on 17 Aug 2024 15:07 next collapse

No. Jesus had his intellect and personality intact, which zombies do not.

NB: I’m taking the Gospels as gospel, here. I do not think the man himself rose from the dead.

Mubelotix@jlai.lu on 17 Aug 2024 15:28 collapse

Who said zombies can’t?

frankPodmore@slrpnk.net on 17 Aug 2024 17:38 collapse

You raise a fair point: what exactly is a zombie? To me, a zombie is not a sapient thing, so if it remembers its previous sapience, it’s not a zombie. But zombies aren’t real, which makes it difficult to define them precisely.

Jarix@lemmy.world on 17 Aug 2024 20:33 next collapse

There are enough stories of intelligent zombies that its easy to say he can be considered a zombie inspite of his intelligence. I think a better argument is that zombies are only one form of animated dead.

Zombies are dead things like liches, ghouls, vampires, wights, revenants etc. just as there are many stories of these creatures there are probably as many, or at least enough of coming back to life and not being some form of animated corpse.

Resurrection, reincarnation, regeneration, wishing and of course miracles

The story of jesus is clearly a divine/holy intervention though which suggests NOT an animated corpse but a true return to life.

So I also say no, but for different reasons.

Will that stop me from calling easter zombie jesus day? It will not :p

Treble@lemmy.blahaj.zone on 18 Aug 2024 15:59 collapse

…yet the maga cult exists in swarms, obeying the loudest orangutang with the mightiest cholesterol.

amio@lemmy.world on 17 Aug 2024 16:34 collapse

In canon (hue hue) nah, “God did it” which explains anything.