Would a surgical puncture to the skull relieve a pressure headache?
from 3ntranced@lemmy.world to nostupidquestions@lemmy.world on 31 Aug 14:46
https://lemmy.world/post/19260665
from 3ntranced@lemmy.world to nostupidquestions@lemmy.world on 31 Aug 14:46
https://lemmy.world/post/19260665
So obviously I know that this isn’t the solution, but would a hole in the head equalize the pressure and relieve pain? Or are pressure headaches within the bloodstream or something internal?
Really wish I had a tire valve on the back of my neck to balance out.
#nostupidquestions
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Find yourself some psylocybin mushrooms, give long term headache releif
A lot of people don’t know mushrooms are a great pain reliever. Even half a gram
Just moved to TX so gotta learn the local flora and fungi.
Even if it did, it would extrude your brain out like a can of pillsbury biscuits
I know there’s pressure a pressure difference but it’s not delta p
Do not put a hole in your skull. No. The headache is not caused by cranial pressure.
Your sinuses may be inflamed, and relieving that pressure might provide temporary relief (like pressing on your forehead) but a hole in your skull wouldn’t fix the underlying sinus problem, and would likely result in worse infections and irritation.
Oh dont worry, this is all purely speculative.
The pain is almost always centered right behind and above the eyeballs. Even when first waking up or not actively straining eyes, usually accompanied by barometric shift.
It’s not like ocular migraines because it doesn’t give any visual flashing or anything like you’d associate with usually.
It’s likely my sleeping, switched to shkikifuton & tatami to try and counteract backpain from soft matresses, but my neck seems to suffer instead.
And even then you should only let your doctors 16-year-old daughter drill the hole…
/s
Too soon lol
They make earplugs for migraines caused by barometric shifts. The company is called weatherx. I’m wearing mine right now.
That’s the first I’ve heard of that solution. I’ll definitely look into them, thanks!
Don’t listen to this person. Drill a hole in your head. The documentary, Pi, showed that this works.
I shouldn’t be surprised at this comment, Piholes seem fairly popular on Lemmy
Zing!
That movie was fucked up.
Shame they cropped out the greek subtitles so poorly.
Short answer, probably not. Anatomy is complex, and the source of the pressure may or may not be at the single point where you most feel it. Even if it is a single point, you wouldn’t be dealing with what caused the pressure, and the body would seal the wound as quickly as it can.
I think they have tried it out around the year 1800.
And skulls are built the same way nowadays :)
I hear they have more microplastics these days
Only if the headache is caused by a hematoma (which would need a brain scan to diagnose).
I think you might be interested on this Wikipedia article: Trepanning
I think a video essay on this was what originally put the thought in my head years ago
You should look up trepanning. It is the earliest form of surgery we have archaeological evidence for (like back in caveman times). Basically, intracranial pressure would be relieved by drilling small holes into the skull using flint. Something like 5% of all skulls archaeologists find have evidence of trepanning, and it’s clearly deliberate, not a war wound.
That’s where I originally got the idea years back. I’m like “cavemen seemed to manage DIY brain surgery pretty well, can’t be that hard”
Then again, the ancient patients could have “survived” but suffer extensive brain damage, we don’t really know.
The thing all those patients have in common is that they are dead.
Fact: 100% of people to breathe air eventually die. Coincidence?
Also we don’t really know why they did it, could have been religious or a punishment for all we know
you should know the brain itself doesn’t have nociceptors (pain receptors). i’m not a doctor, but i conclude that any headache does not origin from inside the skull, except if neuroligical pathways that interpret pain signals are not working properly. It may feel like the headache comes from inside, but it’s actually coming from outside or the skull itself. thus a hole would only make it worse.
I know the brain doesn’t have nociceptors, but the surrounding cavity surely does, so theoretically wouldn’t a positive pressure change put strain on those receptors?
<img alt="" src="https://sh.itjust.works/pictrs/image/b4d234eb-c46c-4995-9ec4-b4bdad731679.gif">
Disclaimer: Not a doctor.
With that said, my late father had a friend that had extreme cranial pressure on his brain, causing constant extreme migraines.
I was told that he’s literally the $6 million dollar man, because they had to install a shunt valve in his skull to relieve excess pressure on his brain.
So I guess even though the brain doesn’t inherently sense pain directly, I guess that excess pressure is still somehow sensed in the form of migraines.
Again, not a doctor, but thanks for coming to my brief Ted Talk.
So what I’m hearing is it is totally possible
From my non-medical understanding, I believe so. But I wouldn’t seek the ancient experimental techniques others have mentioned, I’d definitely seek professional modern medical techniques and advice from neurological experts.
I hope your headaches aren’t quite that bad to warrant such a procedure, as apparently it was quite expensive.
This probably isn’t the best community to ask such a question though. Please consult a qualified experienced medical doctor/surgeon.
If you’re looking for brain shunts, I’ve got a shunt guy…
Am a doctor, this wasn’t actually a migraine and is not how migraines happen. Shunts are placed for elevated intracranial pressure, which can occur for a number of reasons, and do cause headaches. But it’s a very uncommon cause of headaches and a shunt will not fix your actual migraines or tension headaches.
Thank you for your actual medical experience 👍
Now go talk to David M. and ask him, last I know he’s still alive.
I used to work with a guy that had what looked a bit like a Schrader valve (I never got close and looked) a little bit behind one of his ears. I worked with him for a while but never asked what it was for. Any chance you could give some idea as to what it was for? I assumed he may have had a TBI at some point (I feel like I remember an IED story from him) and it was to relieve pressure or something.
No idea unfortunately, but definitely not to release pressure. You don’t get air in your brain, it’s all fluid. Outside of the hospital, all the drains drain to somewhere internal, usually the abdominal cavity
There’s brain fluid in my tum tum?
I have something that looks like that. Mine is a bone mounted hearing aid. Usually there’s a little device plugged into it.
That’s actually a semi common procedure, and hardly makes you a $6,000,000 man. 2 kids per 1,000 are born with Hydrocephalus and will get these shunts put into place, draining the access spinal fluid from their skull, down into their stomach.
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/d6630de8-aa59-45be-b682-f838667a4d1e.gif">
Am doctor. Outside of very rare and specific causes of headache, no this wouldn’t fix anything, just put you at risk for infections.
sighs Oh god. No, it wouldn’t. Here we go.
The name pressure headaches come from the feeling of pressure,not from actual pressure - actually most pressure headaches are not caused by a process within the cerebral cavity at all. Most are related to sinuses, especially the frontal sinuses, teeth, the middle ear/auris media, tension headaches(which are usually cervical/muscular). Only migraines as a cause for pressure headaches are actually within the cerebral cavity but have nothing to do with actual pressure. (Okay, actually we don’t really know how they start - but we are really sure it’s not the pressure)
As the brain matter itself has no pain receptors it does not actually feel pain - but the root of nerves like the Trigeminus, Occipitalis and the layers of tissue covering the brain (Meninges) as well as the vessels can absolutely feel pain. A lot of pain.
Cerebral bleeds, post aneurysm or trauma, usually happen in a very acute form or very slowly - with patients suffering from minutes to month from occasional headaches,often rather mild and not “pressure” headaches. Often after an initial knockout punch. (And at that point I must remind people that someone who has been knocked out needs a brain scan urgently. It’s NOT something to joke about and feel ultra manly,eh, toxic masculinity, about)
The acute form is totally different though - it’s one of the nastiest ways to go. Patients have a sudden onset of massive,life-changing pain, described by survivors as a catastrophic, sharp(*), pain associated with a fast onset of other neurological symptoms.
Another misconception is the fact that the cerebral cavity has no openings - it has quite a few and when the pressure within the skull is increased by a pathologic event like a cerebral bleed or the swelling of the brain the brain gets pushed in these holes - mainly the hole connecting to the spinal column. Which is why cerebral bleeds are so deadly - because the brain goes “stem first” through there - and it’s too small even for the brain stem. And the stem is what regulates breathing,etc.
Other nerves get simply sheered off/cut by the pressure. (This is part of the pain mentioned above - Large nerves being cut by your own blood pressure)
Nevertheless even in these cases the removal of large parts of the skull as it is done by neurosurgeons does not alleviate the pain - the damage to tissue, nerves, etc. is done. The goal is to give the brain room and stop the bleeding. But thankfully we have good options for pain relief these days and these patients are in a very deep sedation/coma for a good reason.
(There are of course rare special cases like hydrocephalus cases, but that’s a bit far fetched here)
So no, it would not help a bit painwise ,even in the most extreme situations.
So as a healthcare professional I generally would advise against drilling into one’s head. It will make a lot my colleagues very angry.
And if you really feel you must do that please consult the nearest psychiatrist first. And if you then still feel like you must do that, make sure to do it during business hours, make also sure you livestream a video of it for the loolz of a lot of HCPs around the world, get a testimony recorded so your next of kin can sue the earlier mentioned shrink that he did not admit you to a closed ward and most importantly get a organ donor registration.
And due to a call a decade back I might also add: DO NOT drill into your own Sinuses as well,even if they are clogged up. Even if you are a doctor. You might accidentally (almost) lobotomize yourself.
Source: Am a paramedic. Seen shit. Seen people do shit that started as an internet hoax.
Gawd no. Take Sudafed. Hell take 2 if you have to. See a doctor. Do not apply power tools to your anatomy! JFC.
I think OP made it pretty clear it’s a hypothetical question