Does anyone else notice an up tick in hostility on Lemmy lately?
from Jomega@lemmy.world to nostupidquestions@lemmy.world on 15 Oct 23:03
https://lemmy.world/post/37403685
from Jomega@lemmy.world to nostupidquestions@lemmy.world on 15 Oct 23:03
https://lemmy.world/post/37403685
I came here around the time the rif app shut down, and the general vibe I get from this place is much more negative than when I joined. Is Lemmy growing more toxic or is it just my imagination?
#nostupidquestions
threaded - newest
Check your communities, and what instances they’re on. Not all are created equal. lemmy.ml tends to be pretty wacko unless you’re of their particular ideological alignment, lemmy.world is very very large and thus has a very very large number of obnoxious shitheads compared to other instances. On the other hand, beehaw.org is intentionally and pathologically positive. I also find lemmy.ca quite friendly, though I might be biased.
Is lemmy.ml is the second largest instance? Or at least rapidly growing? That would explain why it feels this way.
I see a lot more assholes from .world and .shtjstwrks
.ML peeps are either chill or really cringe depending on how militant they are.
It’s just .works, really.
Hi 👋
The majority of shit stains I see are from .ml while .world is a close second.
.ml is the instance run by the developers of the Lemmy fediiverse software, and they themselves are tankies. Do with that information what you will.
Huh, TIL.
Hey, some of us made our accounts when this was the Lemmy instance.
o7
Some of us joined much later when the apicalypse happened.
Since they were the first they used to be the biggest, however they are declining.
.ml stands for Marxist\Lenin afaik. And the mods\admins take it very seriously.
Does it not?
Can confirm some asshole on .ml is chasing around my comments wasting both our time, isn’t that right mistermodal, you incel loser.
Lemmy users are much more entrenched ideologically than an average layman. We all have strong opinions and it can get pretty heated. I avoid posting inflammatory posturing if I’m self aware enough. But I’m just as human and fallible as the rest.
And they think the real world is reflective of what we talk about here. It’s truly bizarre. I’m terminally online, unemployed ATM, but I still get there’s an outside world.
Take all the Trump voter hate for example. Do they not truly understand how under and misinformed most Americans are? Watch Mamdami interview Trump voters in NYC. Not ONE was what we picture as MAGA.
Also, since Trump 1.0, people refuse to talk politics. We’re at a party last month and talking about my new, weird, .22 rifle. I started to bring up a thing in the Big Beautiful Bill that was on-topic and the only thing I find decent in it. “NO. We’re not talking politics.” “I’m NOT. I’m talking about one thing I think is cool and will help gun owners.” Jesus. Now we gotta dance on eggshells.
Yeah, the total destruction of community and third-places is I think the #1 cause of the division of political discourse, but second is that people refuse to engage with other human beings on the topic. They watch TV or browse online, and they get one extremely biased view of the world. They don’t share it with other people where they could get other points of view.
It used to be people would get the paper and talk about it with each other, but that’s taboo now. You take it to an online community who all agree with you. There’s a reason why the infamous Thanksgiving family gathering caused strife. It’s because people were actually having discussions and disagreements. Disagreement is healthy, but people seem allergic to it now.
Disagreement is only healthy if both people are approaching it with the desire to further their understanding
Honestly, I disagree still. That’s the ideal, but even just seeing that there are other opinions held by people you care about is good. If you live in an echo chamber where everyone agrees with you then you think you must be right on everything.
Disagreement with unreasonable people does not change your opinions, it hardens them in the worst way. Also I don’t care about the people making unreasonabke arguments
I think it depends on the situation. I’m not saying to spend time arguing with them. I’m just saying showing them there’s another position that reasonable people they know hold is good. Most people are told the only people who hold a different position than them are crazy people.
I do care about these people, because they vote.
Um, that’s exactly why we are pissed off at them. It’s easier than ever to be informed yet people act like it’s harder, somehow. Pretty fucking enraging.
In my experience, no one but trumpers refuse to talk politics. And it’s because they want to remain actively ignorant. Can’t have anyone revealing the giant holes in their fucked worldview. You might turn them trans, after all.
i’m on the spectrum and can’t handle political conversations if the other person is being confrontational. this doesn’t/shouldn’t make me a right winger, but would make you assume as much about me.
I was talking about in real life, and with people I know well enough to talk about anything remotely deep. Further, I didn’t say I would be confrontational in all cases.
Which is weird, because we are all here. It’s almost like it’s not that hard to find the truth, you just have to be actually invested in finding out what the truth is.
Is malicious ignorance malicious?
Well, many of us are on the spectrum whether that be ADD, ADHD, Asperger’s, or some other form of autism. Helps us to be highly technical and computer savvy, doesn’t help so much with attempting to reframe “right and wrong,” for most of us.
Unfortunately the very entrenchment, ideologically speaking, that these particular “character traits” cause most of us to have, are being celebrated as “immunity to propaganda” in the media. The reality is that we have an innate sense of right and wrong, and that shit can get skewed all over the place in your formative years. The only remedy I have seen for this is the person intentionally exposing themselves to other cultures.
Wouldn’t the latter fixate more on logic & more likely oppose neurotypical nonsense like biases & overdramatic outrage?
This comment seems like an overly simplistic view
I see an attempt to attribute problematic conduct to conditions at least as likely to resist it & not necessarily promoting it.
I’m not sure how much “bias” or “overdramatic outrage” are exclusive to NT people
No one wrote exclusive. I know autists & aspies find precautions around irrational neurotypical tendencies incredibly annoying like walking on eggshells.
Someone more self aware than me!? How dare you! /s
Yeah? Yeah, you think so? Obnoxious? Yeah? You sayin’ there’s obnoxious shitheads round these parts? That what you’re sayin’? Just wanna be clear! Well you’re wrong! Lemmy.World isn’t large at all. The whole fediverse combined isn’t very large! Not like my penis! Can’t believe you said Lemmy.World is full of obnoxious shitheads! Why would you think that? Can I have $20? Your mom gave me $20! Heyyyoooo!!!
“Hey y’all, anyone feeling hostility on Lemmy”
“Yeah, let me tell you what, fuck those fuckers over there. They fucking suck and I hope they rot.”
Like, how do you not immediately block everyone on lemmy.ca after reading this hate?
Sure, if you ignore the assholes who pop into other communities to take a colossal shit on them.
The irony of your stupidity and judgement in that post is hilarious.
Bro they just said “tends to be pretty wacko”
That’s like, really mild. You might need to get some thicker skin.
I’m sorry if my post offended you.
Is that what you think happened here?
If you’re following them around, that’s not living rent free in someone’s head, that’s just being weird.
The whole idea of the phrase is the one living rent free is just enjoying their life while the OTHER person obsesses about them.
If you’re the one doing the stalking, it’s the stalkee that’s living rent free in your head.
You weren’t tagged and still showed up to prove OPs point. It’s not rent free when they’re being stalked by a fucking weirdo basement dweller.
I’m browsing all and you guys are telling your daily ghost stories. I have blocked all of the meme communities where you repost stuff from reddit, so most of what comes up is this or world news, and I don’t need to explain its political bent. You have to realize this comes off as very forced and melodramatic to people on some level. Your being completely unable to take a joke is just icing on the cake.
Daily ghost stories? Me posting memes from reddit? You told a joke? The fuck are you on about, lol?
If you’re suggesting that by saying “rent free” in response to someone outing you for stalking them is a joke, then we have very different definitions of what a joke is. It’s akin to a Republican making a dumbass comment and when confronted responding with, “it’s just a joke”.
You do not have a very strong case for stalking (who, the site itself?) by talking about something you federated with in a public forum. Remember, this is a website the owners willingly hooked up to another. This is like loudly complaining about a business while standing in front of it and acting like one of the customers is stalking you when they say something. It’s hard to believe you would say that sincerely. It’s more like an un-self-aware attempt at manipulation from a child. The internet moderation-attuned desperation to control conversations is palpable. I pity any coworkers you dare to express yourself to.
Do you have any other ways that you would like to describe my saying the words “rent free” as an unforgivable provocation? Let’s see what you come up with this time.
You’re deranged, man. Also wouldn’t he be the one living rent free in your head if you feel the need to check his comments daily? Get a hobby or something.
This is completely delusional. Again, I got here from the All feed. I clicked on this because I was curious what people were framing as “hostility” - clearly you don’t think you are being paranoid and hostile rn, which is extremely funny. You guys failed basic reading comprehension and totally freaked out.
Also, did you seriously not understand that “you” can be plural and nobody thinks you are posting every single meme on multiple different websites? Can you see straight right now?
I wouldn’t call beehaw pathologically positive. They just seem to bee some very nice people that caught to create a community of nice people. It’s not a pathology, it’s a common understanding.
I don’t think so, it’s just a dynamic that any platform (including Reddit) has, and like always, it depends on what community you join and what instances your account is federated with.
Things are quite politically tense right now, and it doesn’t help that there are also a lot of issues outside of that sphere (enshittification, Windows 10 EOL, etc…) that could make people angry as well, and have heated debates.
Also, with any influx of people, there may be tensions as the userbase has more voices from different viewpoints, and some may escalate while others won’t. You do have the ability to pick and choose who your admin is (instance), where you want to post, and where you’d like to visit, and you can make your own community without restrictions, so if one method of moderation in a community seems out of your preference, feel free to explore an alternative.
No, but I do actively block any community designed to rage bait like news, politics, and faith
This is the key. You are not required to engage with the rage. Block people, block communities, block instances! Curate your mood and don’t give space in it to things that will poison it.
Go fuck yourself!
You kiss ya mother wit that mouf!?
I kiss yours
I put on my robe and wizard hat!
no I kiss yours.
Yes.
I change accounts far more often now.
To avoid all the blocks you are getting?
Stalkers.
Oh, that sucks.
No, it’s not just your imagination. It has become distinctly more hostile in all communities.
It really hasn’t
Yes it has
No it hasn’t
It definitely has
Definitely has not
Yeah. I was going to say I feel like people have a lot of “legitimate” reasons to be negative right now, at least in America. Our mental health has been tried.
Oh boy. Try to imagine how people living in nations the USA and Canada exploit part of the world may be feeling right now.
There has got to be some satisfaction watching the US crumble
That's not what I'm referencing at all. can you possibly try to imagine their living conditions? For centuries?
Taking pleasure while watching millions of innocent people suffer ranks up there with sociopathic tendencies.
I’ve seen a lot of hard exclusionary leftists making noise outside of the triad.
Redundant.
I'd position myself further left than "progressive", closer to "leftist", but not of that brand that thinks that anyone who isn't doing exactly what I want is the enemy.
Yeah, we tend to look down on things like people claiming 17 year olds are adults dtf
As a platform grows, you tend to get more diversity of voices. As voices become diverse, conflict becomes inevitable.
Oh yeah? Well I think you’re wrong!
Yeah? Well, so’s your face!
Well, too bad, because I'm right!
Lemmy isn’t really growing. I think it’s been shrinking actually.
The world is increasingly hostile, but let me still seems more humane than any other social media.
No, just an uptick in complaints about it.
Makes me pretty proud if my subscription list, honestly.
I haven’t noticed it lately, but I’ve experienced what you’re talking about. As far as I can tell, it ebbs and flows.
mid 2023 felt honeymoony, but i knew would eventually wear off
There are trolls. Not as many as other places, but we have them.
archive.is/PoUMo
from Bannon:
www.npr.org/2025/02/07/…/trump-week-in-review
The best defense is to call them out on it and then walk away. They’ll downvote the shit out of you, but who tf cares about upvotes and downvotes. If someone is getting downvoted heavily, read what they said carefully before piling on.
I seriously doubt lemmy is under that sort of concerted, planned attack. There are only so many bot handlers and the like and they aren’t wasting time here.
Lol, I want to live in your world.
You honestly think the fascists and oligarchs are aiming for lemmy? We’re not a blip, not even a sparrow, on the social media radar.
en.wikipedia.org/…/List_of_social_platforms_with_…
Say I’m paying you to go out there and influence people. I’d fire you if you came back and said you hit lemmy with your time and my money.
How many people do you know IRL that have even heard of lemmy?!
Sometimes it’s not just the numbers but who those numbers are. Depending on what you’re trying to achieve, influencing all the techy Linux nerds that seem to make up Lemmy might be more helpful than just blowing into the wind for as many as possible on Twitter or whatever.
I’ve got no data either way on this, just some basic social engineering training for work.
No way. It’s definitely impossible for us to ever be deceived. Get a hold of yourself
Can’t see anyone bothering with lemmy’s pathetic user count, not for a few years at least. Like I said, were I paying you for social engineering, I’d be more than disappointed if you went after us.
Maybe your training taught you something I don’t know? If you’re talking about social engineering in the context of IT, I get that bit, taught classes on it myself.
I love the civility of this exchange. It’s why I left reddit. Thanks!
It’s not always about the user count though. It’s about your end goals. There’s two types of social engineering. Mass and targeted. You’re focusing on the mass social engineering.
Say you want specific information on how Crowdstrike works. You could launch a massive social engineering campaign on Twitter but if you don’t catch any of the engineers who work at Crowdstrike then what’s the point? You just spent all that money for nothing. It would be better to find where those engineers socialize online and try to inject yourself there, doesn’t matter the size of that community and it could very well be on Lemmy in one of the programmer communities.
Now if you want to convince the entire world of something then yeah, focus on the big user counts, don’t worry about the small fry communities. It’s all about your end goal.
Agreed on influencing say influencers (e.g. decision makers in corporate IT for example who presumably would be somewhere on here)
<img alt="" src="https://c.tenor.com/XOxOy4vXpEAAAAAd/tenor.gif">
From personal experience, this is definitely untrue.
There is a phenomenon going on right now where tiny sites are getting knocked offline due to sudden traffic, basically DDOSing them. It has been found that the automation of these bot farms sends out scrapers to find new places where you can post on the site. Like anything, anything hat allows you to post anything on the site. So it will find some tiny store’s webfront, see it has a place for customer reviews, and then tell the bot farm it has found new land. The place then gets swarmed with bot traffic.
So literally everywhere you can post anything is getting bot traffic right now.
I used to think like that until on the e-mail address I had for my lemmy.world account (an account which I left following that) I started getting e-mails in my native language from an organisation based in Tel-Aviv inviting me to attent a “learn about Israel” online course.
This was when I was already very vocal about the actions of Israel in Gaza.
That e-mail wasn’t public and as far as I know only server Admins have access to that stuff.
When the largest Lemmy instance is infiltrated at the Admin level by state actors (and that’s also very clearly the case for Moderation in the main forums there, as reflected by their moderation actions with even one Moderator of the news forum being very openly Zionist in his posts elsewhere), the idea that there are bots and sockpuppets around in Lemmy trying to shift opinions for the benefit of nations and even large political forces, isn’t exactly outrageous.
I mean, if I remember it correctly the budget of Israel’s Hasbara ops is somewhere around $1 billion a year, so plenty of money to have a few people at least part time trying to influence a place with maybe a few hundred thousand people, like Lemmy.
It’s trepidation due to the asinine purity tests which ultimately lead to everyone being called a “Nazi”. Now STFU Nazi! Whose side are you on?!
There’s two kinds of people who post this.
People who are extremely naive and don’t understand the context of what they’re saying
Actual fascists
Ha! I literally have you tagged as a fascist, so not a surprising comment.
I have noticed more people inferring things from a small part of a reply and rather than read and try to understand it, they insted get upset about it and reply back about what they think the op said.
Same with going off the headlines. I am well aware that we lose 90%+ of communication over text, but damn, some of these fucking people. You have to learn to couch your comment in such a way that even obvious sarcasm and the like is obvious.
To all those joking about being autists and not getting social clues, I see you.
It’s what comes with more users. As people you don’t know start writing in styles you’ve only seen parroting arguments you disagree with, the urge to shut things down increases.
Plus, there ends up being more stuff to read in the same amount of time, which leads to shallower reading to cover it all.
This has been a consistent issue I have seen more on Lemmy over Reddit since day one, TBH.
No it hasn’t! That’s just what they want you to believe! You heard nothing! Make him repent Asmodai!
OF ALL THE WATCHERS IN THE ROCK WHY DID I GET ONE THAT TALKS‽‽‽
yep.
i will write out three paragraphs… get multiple replies about like three words I said that are taken totally out of context.
i’d say trolls/bots… but i know way too many people IRL who do the very same thing. they are just stupid assholes looking to cause drama to puff up themselves as ‘outing’ everyone as evil/bad because they are ‘warriors’ for justice. their entire existing is all about inflating their own ego and being willfully ignorant and their primary hobby in life is being ‘offended’ by anything/everything.
what i can’t get is why people like being around people like this… but they do for some reason.
Like this post & comments where the original context they leave out has an obvious, inoffensive interpretation, and they instead go wild fixating on a small part with disparaging interpretations not indicated by the context?
Why do you think they can’t understand it? Are you saying their stupid? All lemmy users are stupid except you? Look at smarty mcsmartpants over here
/s
What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Navy Seals, and I’ve been involved in numerous secret raids on Al-Quaeda, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in gorilla warfare and I’m the top sniper in the entire US armed forces. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Internet? Think again, fucker. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of spies across the USA and your IP is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You’re fucking dead, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that’s just with my bare hands. Not only am I extensively trained in unarmed combat, but I have access to the entire arsenal of the United States Marine Corps and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass off the face of the continent, you little shit. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little “clever” comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your fucking tongue. But you couldn’t, you didn’t, and now you’re paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit fury all over you and you will drown in it. You’re fucking dead, kiddo.
Are you aware that there are people in this world that have a severe medical condition which causes them to be that way? My mother for instance is one of those people. She is a truck driver that has bad knees and a bad back from driving the truck but you probably do not care about that case either. Oh well I am not one of those people I am 6’4" 245lbs and I exercise every day. I would love to see you say something like to my mother in front of me. Probably never happen though you are probably just an internet tough guy. I doubt very seriously you would say that to someones face. Just my thought.What do you think. Oh I am sorry you probably do not have a brain. I on the other hand will be happy to buy you a plane ticket to come here and see if you have the nerve to say that to someone I know.
What the fuck did you just say about the God Emperor of Mankind, you little heretic? I´ll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Space Marines, and I´ve been involved in numerous secret raids on Chaos, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in Plasma Warfare and I´m the top Inquistor in the entire Imperium. You are nothing to me, but just another Xeno scum. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of wich has never been seen before on Terra, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that heretic rambling to me? Think again, fucker. As we speak,I am contacting my secret network of Vindicare Assasins across the Emperium, and your IP is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You´re fucking dead, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that´s just with my bare hands. Not only am I extensively trained in CQC, but I have access to the entire arsenal of the Imperium of Man, and I will use it to it´s full extent to wipe your miserable ass of the face of the continent, you little shit. If only you could have know what unholy retribuition you little ‘‘clever’’ heresy was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your fucking tongue. But you couldn ´t, you didn´t, and now you´re paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit fury all over you, and you will drown in it. You´re fucking dead, heretic. Extermanatus upon your hive world.
They got tired of harassing people on Bluesky and changed things up a bit
This place (old.lemmy.zip) is downright chill. Then again, I just came off Reddit (after 14 years there…) and that is in full rage-bait algorithm-driven meltdown. Feels like Reddit in 2010 here. Just lovely…
Lately? I find it comes and goes.
Didn’t notice anything like this, not even slightly.
Welcome back, I’ve been here the whole time and currently it seems a bit more toxic and hostile than when RIF shut down, I feel there are a couple more contrarians now than before but it hasn’t been a steady decline. There has always been the odd jerk and troll on this site. I would say the time Lemmy was most wholesome when !cat@lemmy.world flooded the front page with black cats, it was such a cute problem for us to have. Anyone else remember that?
Like others I’d say it’s cyclical month to month. This year there’s daily doom in the news with US politics. If you want to avoid that then block !news@lemmy.world, !politics@lemmy.world, !usa@midwest.social, and other news and politics if it fills up with Trump posts. 2024 was a lot more hopeful and I think that reflected in the average user’s demeanor even if there was bothsidesism, Gaza stuff, Ukraine stuff and Trumpism stuff. You’ll be informed of important developments as Trump stuff leaks out on occasion but you don’t need to be constantly engaged. Also if you do curate your All/Local feed then maybe some new communities sprung up that need pruning to fit your desired vibe.
Also: If you see a crapton of comments on a post with low votes then you know best to turn and run from the thread where most of the comments are.
I think it’s always been the same. I’ve received weird ass hostility before but it’s been consistently spaced.
Reading the comments here brings up a question I’ve had. Does it really make any difference what instance I’m on? I thought the whole benefit of federation was that it does not matter where I’m coming from.
It does kinda matter.
If the instance you are on defederates from another instance, you wont see the defederated instance’s content.
IIRC, the only thing you would really miss on Lemmy.World would be Hexbear. Maybe Exploding Heads? I don’t recall the entire list. But they’re all dipshit trolls, so nothing of value is actually being lost.
Somewhere on your instance page, usually at the bottom, you can click "instances" and see which are federated and not.
Yeah it kinda does, WHEN YOUR INSTANCE IS ALWAYS DOWN AAAARGH
It 100% does. I’m on 3 to get different flavors of Lemmy. I was on 4, but left an instance because of tone.
Such is life on the internet sometimes I guess
Not really besides maybe more conservative trolls upsetting people in their usual favourites like unpopular opinion communities. Negative communities are troll attracting nectar generally.
Filter your content to get the vibe you want.
Blocking the porn and impotently hostile makes it quite the chill platform.
I noticed it a few months ago. It feels like a sudden, inorganic shift. Either all the good people have trickled off to a better basin, or someone or something has influenced Lemmy users
Pretty sure Lemmy got on the influence bot radar some few months ago. Comments are now deeply negative and constantly drumming the 2FA and guillotine remedies to every complaint. Interactions outside of this kind of content I still find Lemmy users to be magnitudes higher quality than Reddit.
Bots warning us about using better account security sounds pretty wholesome actually
Everyone should keep in mind: Besides the darkened tone of the world seeping into nearly everything, this place is probably crawling with shit-stirrers of a slightly subtler flavor than your typical obnoxious troll.
This effect might be from lemmy users in general hating everything about the world right now, or it might be the work of bots and/or illicitly paid humans fronting as the “general left.” The type that reflects your viewpoints pretty well but injects their comments with a little something extra, inflaming you or depressing more than what seems reasonable, maybe pushing you a little closer to the edge, whatever that edge may be.
We (or at least I) have no idea how much astroturfing is happening in the comments. It’s probably best to take anything that seems peculiarly provocative with a grain of salad.
Grain of salad?
I don’t think this place is big enough yet for my conspiracy theory to make any sense, but if I was the CEO of a company like Reddit and I wanted to prevent users moving to Lemmy I would make a bunch of accounts on here and spark as much drama and infighting as possible. And there’s been so much of it lately, whether it be callout posts on different instances or people concern trolling under posts, that it does feel so inorganic. When you come on here hoping for a better place and you see users writing mini manifestos calling out another user’s character flaws, it is extremely offputting.
Re: the title: Yes 😔
No. Why? Are you accusing me of something? Are you threatening me??
/s
Yeah the news are triggering the worst instincts of some users who tend to lash out alot, and some trolls might be taking advantage of that
Ugh. I understand being a bit on edge in these dark times, but lashing out at people on your side doesn’t help anything.
For sure. I posted content on selfhosted for the first time and got called a “filthy boomer” because it was a screenshot, then people basically told me to grow thicker skin went I complained. Why be better than reddit huh? Guess people just want reddit 2.0
I would actually compare it to Slashdot 3.0, but your sentiment stands.
Look, unless you have functional code included in your comment, or are Richard Stallman, it’s just not worth reading!
I mean honestly filthy boomer to a screenshot is kind of hilarious.
Maybe they’re not telling us that the screenshot was taken with a Nokia and sent to email over their sms to email bridge?
Was a simple screenshot of a Discord announcement since they didnt have any links
Yeah, I’m gonna stop taking screenshots and use an analogue camera to capture my screen, then run to the photo printing shop, stop by the hobby store for some tracking paper, and track the photo. Scan that bad boy, and Bob’s your uncle!
Now what would I then be called by these keyboard warriors?
Probably a hipster.
Shit. You’re on to me…
“Why can’t everyone just be nice to each other all the time” is what lead us to where we are.
I’m not arguing for being an asshole but when you force everyone to be kind all the time online you get people that are empowered to and motivated to wrap up abhorrent shit in a pleasing package. Racist dog whistles, selfish political propaganda, etc.
I’m not saying that applies here but I DO think it’s important that people are allowed to be assholes online. The internet really started its descent when people started putting bubble wrap on everything.
You’re free to engage or not to.
People have become so used to echo chambers and safe spaces that they forget what things were like when they didn’t exist. And it was better.
You SHOULD be encountering assholes online and encountering opinions you disagree with regularly, because that is the real the world.
Nice to see another person who understands this. They want their social media experience to not make them feel anything negative, and loves their bubble where everyone agrees with them, despite it being a false, curated, forced experience.
When someone writes something they dont agree with, they go into keyboard warrior mode and either tries to put the person down with downvoting and insults, or mod reporting, which is similar to running to dad and crying about someone being bad.
Its like people refuse to grow up today. Argue for your opinion, stop censoring and pushing down opinions you dont agree with.
Exactly.
Being exposed to people that believe differently than you challenges your own beliefs, and theirs.
When women started opening about the bullshit they dealt with, a lot of people listened. Some didn’t, but a lot of people did. Some men said “hey, you know, now that you mention it, there’s some kind of fucked up shit about being a guy, too”.
Anyone that had ever engaged with any real feminist theory or any facet of gender studies said: you’re absolutely right. Everyone else completely drowned them out.
The internet around that time largely had the response of “shut up, the women are talking”. Not all of it, not everyone, but it was very common.
Some men kept patiently listening, others stopped listening and started talking, others stopped listening, got angry, and started yelling. Some were never listening at all.
Now we have hordes of young misogynistic racist shitheels who may have been receptive to other points of view once but are now so firmly entrenched in their shiftiness it may never change. And they’ve found nice cozy places to whip their impotent rage into a society-destroying frenzy. It festered in critical mass, quietly, until it built up a level where it could burst open like a cyst.
The lesson here has nothing to do with gender, but highlights the importance of LISTENING TO PEOPLE, and being exposed to their viewpoints while exposing them to yours. Even the most vocal, selfish, pigheaded, racist conservative has legitimate concerns driving some of their shittiness: fear of uncertainty over the future, economic uncertainty, poverty, lack of education, fear of death. None of these things validate the shittiness but they do explain and they’re the levers by which these views change.
And I totally disagree with that narrative.
Because in my experience I listened, but then was guilty of the crime of pre-rape. And then i stopped listening to feminists. Being male and doing anything male-coded was a crime to them. Popular feminism decided men were evil. Full stop.
then 10 years later… many of those very same feminists are now preaching 1950s subordination to their husband and God and many are of them anti-trans advocates. Every feminist I went to grad school with became everything she claimed to hate in her 20s. And icing on the cake, they would inherent tons of money from their parents and start lecturing others to grow up and work hard like they did…
wtf is ‘real’ feminist theory, btw? feminist theory has 100s of flavors.
Sure, they may have decided men are evil but so what. We arent, obviously. Men are actually much nicer to eachother than women are.
Let them talk, its a good warning signal who has air in their head and who has some brains.
FWIW my entire life i’ve known people who do this shit IRL. My college campus was rife with people like this.
My daily life is also regularly full of people like this.
Toxic positivity is how you get the worse shit. If you can’t call someone else a fucker and move on then there’s too much protection for the truly deranged.
There’s a large gap between being rude and being Hitler but many places online seem to forget this and treat all forms of negativity as equally extreme and it just results in the worse psychopaths who understand how to mask to have the loudest platform.
No. Fuck you.
/s
If I don’t see that, am I the problem? 🤔
Seems the same as it’s always been. Was it always negative? Do I not feel like it’s negative currently?
I’m not sure.
Places would change up and down in tone and attitude since the days of Usenet, BBSes, and FidoNet. It's not the platform, it's the people. How the world is in RL affects how people talk online, and the world changes over time.
The simpler answer may be that your feed has changed some since you started and you're pulling in discussions that have a different vibe than when you started. Just as you can grow your feed by browsing around, you can cull certain places that tend to be darker by blocking people or instances.
This is a first for me. Be RB, gotta run to the automated TM real quick.
I've seen it in both forms online and in chat, but I'm also old so it might be a depreciated form. I'm a walking internet archive.
There has been a noticeable uptick in new rightist accounts lately.
Instead of blocking people, I tag the bad actors in Voyager and have noticed that most of the toxicity comes from the same small group of specific people.
I’ve recently noticed a lot of new accounts which post a whole series of news articles and then get deleted. Notot fake news or conspiracies but mostly reputable sites. No idea what’s going on there.
Sockpuppet accounts selectively posting articles to sway a opinion about a country or person/s?
If they’d post links to hit pieces or sites such as RT maybe.
This is actually usually the case
An example right in this thread
That person is complaining about political axe-grinding seeping into every corner of every community. Yes they used a mild caricature of anti-Trumpism but this isn’t what I’d call a “rightist.” Although I am on the left, politically, I frequently argue with people here who are even further to the left. I don’t think chanting about seizing the means of production is… productive, and I say so. This probably makes me a “rightist account” in some people’s eyes. I’m also a bootlicker because I don’t advocate for lining up all CEOs in front of a firing squad.
It’s clear if you look at their other comments.
Actually yeah it just clicked for me what “TDS” is. I guess I didn’t have to go further than this very comment. Trump Derangement Syndrome is more than a mild caricature - it’s a codified partisan dismissal of all Trump criticism. Anyone who uses the term unironically is a Trumper.
I withdraw my objection.
Yes, but sometimes I wonder if it is just the nature of what happens when a social media network grows large. I did observe how some subreddits instantly get more toxic as they grow bigger too
… On the other hand though, coincidentally I did see some very recent comments that are decidedly more right-wing than the general Lemmy userbase. I personally try not to judge ppl’s political orientation but I do wonder if there’s something weird going on
ever IRL hobby/group i ever did went from a cool chill group to being full of rabid assholes once it got ‘popular’. as in… people heard it was ‘cool’ and wanted to join because they want to be ‘cool’. as soon as people are doing something for status/image and not because they actually enjoy/love it… that’s when the toxicity starts. because the cool people are the insecure shallow types who need to crap on anyone who is ‘uncool’.
status chasing is the root of a lot of it, imo.
People are desperately combing through comments, looking for something to be outraged about. That’s what happens in echo chambers - when the outgroup isn’t around to be attacked, people start eating their own. It turns into this insane purity spiral where nobody is ever good enough.
yeah i’ve noticed this. the people who harass me go to my comment history, start downvoting everything i say or replying to old comments and/or reporting them… just like people do on reddit.
one disagreement on one comment or issue becomes a personal vendetta
that kind of craziness never happened to me on reddit until the past few years. mostly in my local subreddit where insane people who report and harass you for something supporting or disagreeing with mayors policies.
over the weekend i had some guy scream in my face what homo i was for wearing suede boots. apparently suede makes you gay, i had no clue. such a helpful thing to be informed of.
These people need to be flushed out of here. On the other hand I stand by almost everything I’ve said in my comment history, so, good luck to them.
There’s a setting in voyager that shows you how you voted on other people. I use that to block people… if you are -5 to me then I’ll never see you again 😘 Lemmings.world people are among the worst somehow… just saying
It’s more along the lines of people making an elephant out of an anthill. Your average person is a draa-addict
I’ve not noticed that in particular yet. but it might be because I block accounts that don’t add constructively to the comments, so maybe I’m not seeing a lot of the worst behaviour.
Can confirm. Lemmy became a lot friendlier after I blocked the worst of the permanently outraged communities and a bunch of people with extreme views.
I try to limit that to the worst cases, though, as I don’t want to drive “bubblification” too much…
I’ve gotten pretty zealous with the block button. When I see a comment thread with some dipshit who clearly isn’t being constructive I just block them immediately now.
Hmm… maybe. The state of the world has been pretty awful for the past year so I imagine that plays a part. Aside from trolls, lots of us are on edge as the whole world seems to tilt right with propaganda and AI.
That said, I like us.
I browse bluesky too and find I actually prefer Lemmy because it’s a bit more self-policing… Like regarding AI slop, bluesky is fucking rampant with it, like Trump dressed as a clown or Newsom with abs, it’s fucking awful. Lemmy has a couple communities for AI but on average, you try that shit and you’ll get publicly shamed. That could be considered mean, but I appreciate it (especially if it’s AI I can’t even tell).
Yup, it’s happened to me a couple of times this week alone. It’s getting silly.
It doesn’t feel unique to Lemmy to me. I’m seeing higher levels of hostility in just about any environment broad enough to include left and right wingers
I have been threatened and harassed in person multiple times the past few years. but left and right wingers. by trans and anti-trans folks, etc. i’ve had people shove and try to physically start fight with me while i was waiting for a takeout order or coffee.
angry people just want to beat up any one that is in front of them. and they will see what they want to see. the angry left assumes i’m a meathead trump supporter, the angry right assumes i’m a soyboy homo.
So wait are you wearing both thigh-highs and a maga cap?
So what are you really
I’m resisting the urge to jump to conclusions, however I can’t help but observe that objectively there seems to be a common denominator in your situation. Either way, it sucks that that’s been your experience and I hope things change for the better for you.
I don’t know that I’ve noticed a real uptick. But in the past couple weeks I have noticed a few ridiculous right wingers and I blocked most of them since seeing their bullshit is bad for my mental health.
Yeah maga place looks like it’s up to 21 idiots sharing a brain cell now, whereas I think it was 12 a couple weeks ago. Wonder if there’s a critical mass for those fucks or if they’ll find lemmy too progressive to stick around. I guess they could just circlejerk on their own instance.
Not really. But I purposely avoid any politics related community.
how?, please teach me your secret
Depending on your client (i use Sync so im not sure about others) but using the filters for certain keywords can block out a bit of the noise. The first two i added a while back were ‘trump’ and ‘musk’ and it was immediately more pleasant.
I use Voyager and also used keyword filters. Currently I have “Trump, Musk, MAGA, GOP, Repubilcan, Democrat” I still get mostly US political crap content… It seems these filters only apply to the titles?
It makes no difference. The single minded fuckwits will inject politics into a thread about cheese sandwiches.
Cheese sandwiches are a tool of capitalist oppression. They are a symbol of how the working class is unable to get the nutrition they need and is yet another attempt by the liberals to make you forget their support of genocide. Eating cheese sandwiches supports genocide.
This is the issue I’ve seen everywhere. Military grade TDS. Even if you want to chat about your love for onions in an onion-based community, someone will probably talk about how orange man destroyed onion farmland and is a fascist. I don’t think there’s a way to avoid the constant repetitive rage seeping into everything.
What is TDS?
Trump Derangemenr Syndrome, which is where people are concerned about Trump doing blatantly illegal shit (this is somehow a bad thing apparently)
One day historians will with any luck define whatever trump has as the Trump Derangement Syndrome.
Trump Derangement Syndrome should be when you agree with and defend everything the deranged pedophile says.
I would like to note that although correct this comment is itself a bit rude
I dont care if I offend the fuckwits. Maybe they can do a little self reflection.
I would recommend you do the same. Why do you think they are bringing up politics in seemingly unrelated conversations?
Read the part I wrote about “single minded fuckwits.”
That pretty much sums it up.
Is it possible that politics has relevancy to a large portion of our lives and cannot be cleanly separated from our other experiences?
Yes its more negative. Comes with more users who want to play keyboard warriors over things they feel strongly about.
The hostility has been here for quite a while, though. When the migrating happened from Reddit to Lemmy it was all nice and cozy but after a year or so the hostility was already there. Very often people did not want to acknowledge this (and started to heavily downvote the particular comment stating this). Plus with what is happening* in the world, the negativity from reality seeps into the digital world.
But anyway, the best thing to do is just block anyone who is hostile towards you for no actual reason. Has no point to put energy and/ or time in it.
well have you noticed (waves at everything) in the world?
Replies have certainly taken on a more Reddit-like quality to some things. Like rude for the sake of being rude.
[insert funny rude response here]
It seems that out in the real world and here in the digital world we have been allowed/engineered to lose our civility and respect. Reminds me of the rock orchestra DEVO.
Civility as a desirable trait seems so bizarre to me. Historically it’s been used as a tool of oppression. In fact, it still is (remember those portions of Tennessee who lost their representatives due to “decorum” “violations” when they had the audacity to protest gun violence rather than just saying “thoughts and prayers”?).
I haven’t noticed anything in particular, and I do post in more controversial areas like Politics and News. There’s always a chance to get negative feedback in those c/.
I have noticed some ancient-ass reddit-type reposts of the same old shit that circulates reddit, though. That junk can die.
E: maybe I stand corrected. I asked for a source for a claim and got downvoted because someone’s ego couldn’t take it or it was too hard to provide a source.
I’ve seen roughly the same time frame. As far as I can tell no, this is just how toxic this place is. There’s a bunch of people who continuously claim people from reddit are coming and bringing some form of toxic with them, but as often as not those people seem super toxic. There’s a huge community of Linux fanboys who circle jerk over the same exact talking points in different meme formats (the talking point being “windows 11 is spyware, Linux Just Works ad doesn’t even require a login – but don’t worry guys, this is the year of the
Linux desktopsteam deck”). There’s a huge circle jerk over whether or not Russia is bad. There’s the “liberals aren’t leftists, liberals are capitalist genocidal shitbags” circle jerk. None of these have really changed in at least the last year, it’s the same people making the same posts on the same topics.But, it’s nice to see a news feed of interesting posts so as long as you ignore the bullshit it still seems fine. Or if you like arguing.
People are demonstrably worse behaving online. This will be true in just about any online community. The more people that join, the more you’ll see.
Idk some of the worst comments I have ever seen are from .world users, maybe not super toxic but definitely redditor type responses. Maybe that’s just because .world is the most popular instance that I see it when I check a bad comment though ¯_(ツ)_/¯
Either .world or .ml
Both are basically the two largest sources of toxic people.
I considered making a really insulting comment on this just for fun, but I just can’t be arsed.
I appreciate the honesty.
I doubt that anyone who came from reddit either as an exile or willingly can really notice any additional toxicity. Maybe the early adapters.
You’re really being a drag, dude. What’s with you throwing all this shade? Wanna fight about it? /s
Yes. I’ve also noticed if you say something mods don’t like they will remove your comments. This place is more of the same with censorship… in terms of removing opposing ideas.
(This person who complains about “censorship” says some seriously bigoted shit. It’s not a moderation problem, it’s a MAGA problem.)
What gets you permabanned for “spam” from the .ml meme comm:
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/eaa45bd0-46e1-43ea-b42b-ccdddd2b6afb.jpeg">
OP being a magatwat aside, mods being unaccountable children is a problem.
I haven’t noticed much, but I do have a lot of people blocked…
The most important thing for me is that the amount of truly thoughtful comments I’ve seen is higher than on any other platform I use.
And discourse is generally more respectful. Disagreements are handled in a constructive manner at a much higher rate than on any other platform I have used.
Yeah, it’s nice to be able to have actually constructive discussions with people I don’t agree with. That’s rare on the internet.
I’ve blocked a few, makes a huge difference.
You suck! (im sorry im just kidding)
Well fuck you (pls)
🥸
It comes & goes in waves. Do you not like ridiculing & poking their impotent outrage & hostility to self-reflective examination?
It seems like some AI bots with contrarian comments in order to drive engagement or strong arm wild political platforms have started to leak into the fediverse as a whole. Still better than other options though.
Got some examples?
Yeah, I’ve seen a bunch of what appear to be bot accounts dropping douchey comments. They’ve been down voted to oblivion, but it sucks seeing it here.
Blame reddit. Lemmy is the home for us, the permabanned.
The world has been deteriorating a lot in recently years and inflation is high.
Yes, it seems to be.
Damn I miss rif :/ that was when I came over here too. I’m not on here as much but everywhere there seems to be an uptick in hostility these days
Block and block often. Now if lemmy admins will just unspez their attitude about reciprocal blocks I can cull the herd of raging douche nozzles infesting every online community.
Compared to election season? Nah. But everybody sees different stuff on Lemmy.
Not that I’ve noticed, but the whole world is growing more toxic as far-right ideology becomes more and more accepted everywhere, so I wouldn’t be surprised.
You want a piece of this??
Lately? Were you not here during elections when a bunch of kids were accusing everyone of supporting genocide?
I think it’s still like that, actually.
It’s actually quite a bit more tame than it once was.
They still are but I’ve learned to love the block list and use it judiciously with people who go beyond good faith arguments of any sort.
That’s most of the people here in political conversations.
“Republicans are fascist”
“I know. That’s why I’m voting Democrat.”
“Democrats aren’t real leftists”
“I’m aware but this isn’t the time for purity politics.”
“Democrats support genocide.”
“And Republicans don’t?”
“Both sides are equally bad so voting is dumb. Don’t vote.”
“Listen, I’ve got friends and family with skin in this game. Both parties fucking suck but you know what really sucks? Having a fucking fascist dimwit who thinks your cousin is subhuman because she was assigned male at birth as your president.”
“So you support genocide? Typical libshit.”
“Ok, then what is your alternative?”
“You would know what it is if you read this dry, arcane bullshit about the reification of contemporary autonomous groups in Third World popular movements.”
Nailed it! That’s damn near a perfect representation of ever conversation with them.
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/2a25ff85-ebf7-4e5e-8d0f-f154e3667c7e.png">
The lack of perspective from leftist that say that. Sometimes I’m not sure if they are fed posting.
<img alt="" src="https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/2a527c9c-f1c4-4668-b5b9-dbe5a3f79222.jpeg">
Those ain’t leftists. They’re enlightened centrists. I.e., poorly disguised fascists trolling and sowing dissent.
Were you not here for that same year when anyone who said that democrats shouldn’t be supporting genocide was accused of being a russian chinese trumper republican tankie bot? Oh, and as you accused in your comment just now, a child.
democrats still have no business supporting genocide. It’s shameful and there needs to be accountability. None is forthcoming.
As you can all see, some of them are still around.
I was just saying that there was also hostility and accusations against the anti-genocide left from the pro-genocide center.
Which continues to this day. Not gonna start accepting genocide just because you don’t like hearing that it’s wrong.
Is the gEnoCiDe in the room with you now? If not, can you show us on a doll where the gEnOciDE hurt you?
Newsflash for ya my guy,
Genocide is not a new thing. It’s always been around. And no matter how much people cry about it, it’ll continue regardless.
But you do you!
Gonna block you now as I can’t see any reason to think you’ll ever have anything to say that I would take interest in.
Gloat.
Yeah. I’ve enjoyed Lemmy casually for years, but this last year has really killed my desire to read or post here.
For me it’s everywhere. I still come to these things out of habit or because i don’t have energy for a regular hobby, but it’s getting draining. All of social media just brings me back to politics, even if funny memes are in between. I also have a habit of reading comments, and then some dingus brings the one non political thing back down to politics anyway.
Because social media is used to program you. What to think, what opinions to have. So thats why you see politics and fighting, its all about influencing populations. And where do you influence the youngest? Right here on social media.
Post quality go down. Echo chamber go up.
I also noticed how every post just has 5-10 random down votes. Like perfectly fine post in the correct community, not controversial, no rules broken, -10 down votes.
Tempting to downvote that post, not gonna lie
People here do tend to downvote for disagreeing with any little part of something that was said.
Little snowflakes.
No, fuck you
/j
Jarcasm?
It was just a soke ;)
Jargasm
I hate that writing this comment made me think of jar jar binks from star wars
Can’t wait for the “Jarjargasm” category to pop up… in places.
Posting that question here, in a subreddit that says no stupid questions! How dense can a person be? OP is a cunt.
Yes, blocking posts from .ml and dbzer0 helped. Same goes for just liberally blocking anybody, who starts screaming instead of participating nicely.
I’ve been considering blocking .world, as some of the mods are behaving like power tripping reddit mods. But it’s the biggest instance and without it I wouldn’t have any content.
I’m still here at .world because every time I think I’ve identified a better instance to go to where people seem to like it, I see someone else who recommends blocking it.
I definitely see the appeal of (and need for) blocking individuals, but I think that instances are too big and varied to neatly paint everyone with the same brush.
Would still be using .world but they don’t allow VPNs. So fuck .world
Wait, what? Where’d you hear that from? I’m on .world and my home internet is hard wired to a VPN. I’ve never had a problem.
I also always access .world through my VPN.
Oh shit I’m on dbzer0 - just seemed like a good geeky instance. Is it a problematic one? Thx!
I have heard it several times, but it has also been debunked. I’d stay there if your only reasons are some vague rumours. I mean there are shitheads on any server.
Thanks! I’m still a Lemmy account noob though I’ve been lurking for a year. Ex-Reddit - finally deleted my account there, it was time!
Part of what took me so long to sign up for Lemmy was ADHD and trying to choose an instance to join! So in the end I picked a geek/coder/anarcho/punk/egalitarian seeming one.
Hadn’t really thought about people blocking the whole instance. I mostly just like to help answer questions and engage in some online banter.
Is this the point in my Lemmy life where I decide to create a second account on another instance just in case!? Probably, lol!
Yeah, just hang around and get the feel for it all! It’s like old reddit but everyone can make a server.
I remember they implemented migration tools for when you want to change server but I don’t know anything more about that.
Cheers !
Let me preface this by saying that the following are my opinions. They’re based on my experiences and prejudices. Take it with a grain of salt, and make of it what you want.
I don’t block users by instance, just posts. Posts on your instance tends to get moderated heavily one-sided. I got reprimanded (I think it was a temp ban, but I can’t remember) for being skeptical about AI. I don’t want to spend time and energy engaging in a discussion under those conditions.
But that doesn’t mean every dbzer0 user is an AIvangelist. Same goes for .ml, they’re not all tankies … although I’ve found that not engaging with .ml users tends to give me a more pleasant experience in general.
Yup, lost of people here accusing others of being “genocide apologists” for expressing even the slightest approval or agreement with Harris or Biden on anything. Yet, somehow, they don’t seem to want to criticize the current administration, blaming everything on the liberals as if they’re the ones solely responsible for this mess. Curious, isn’t it.
How about “spreading misinformation” when making a personal comment on the internet. People cant see the difference between official publication and personal opinion… :)
Maybe we should just disallow personal comments and let the ministry of truth speak for the citizens.
I don’t follow.
I imagine it can be hard to scroll past someone saying something very off the wall. When you read someone’s comment it’s hard not to feel like they’re talking directly to you, and if you don’t align with what they’re saying, especially if you’re far from it, it can be hard to resist correcting them or giving them your opinion, when I catch myself doing this, I try to reframe it to ask a question, rather than dump opposing facts.
But there’s another perspective I try really hard to keep in mind, if I were sitting at a table with a group of people and someone was loudly saying those things to me in person, I wouldn’t engage. I’d move to a quieter spot and ask the people I do like at the table to come for a chat there, or I’d acknowledge their feelings (but not the topic) and move to a different conversation topic.
But I feel like I need more practice at doing this when it’s in a text form of socializing, as this is.
I notice some amazing people on here, whom I aspire to learn from, that handle conflicting opinions with grace, and inclusion.
And I understand the dehumanisation that text conversations, present, it can be easy to imagine a hostility that may not be behind the comment. We’re all filling in the blanks of the personality behind the commenter. I worked a checkout for a good decade, so I’m very familiar with positions that can become dehumanised. Especially seeing as that seemed to be throughout a time when a huge bulk of people felt like they were only going to get righted the situation they believed had wronged them, by yelling or getting massively agro at the poor checkout chick who was gunna set that right wrong, because fk corporations, I enjoyed giving as much free stuff away as possible, any excuse, within the rules I could muster.
I absolutely understand tensions being high, currently, with world events being what they are. And there’s so much propaganda trying to brain wash us into being an army for their cause, and it’s all rage baity. So there’s even more rage and tension built up. I get it.
I really feel for people who can’t, and haven’t been helped to learn how to help and sooth their emotions, and then those emotions fester into all consuming things. And they find a cause to funnel that emotion into. Without really addressing that emotion, therefore not actual helping, processing or soothing that emotion.
See, we feel a feeling first, and then we ascribe a meaning, after. Except those two parts of the brain don’t actually communicate. The emotional brain is essentially non verbal, and the thinking brain, is verbal, but obviously it doesn’t do emotions. So you have this thinking guy in your head trying to tell you what emotions mean, except that guy is not an expert and knows nothing about them.
Your emotional brain is essentially a, very detailed messenger system for checking the temperature of the room. If shit feels off, it sends an alarm. Your emotions are a message to you that the shower temperature is too hot. It’s not really about that argument you had with your sibling last fortnight.
And to top it off, your emotional brain is non verbal, so all that ranting that you do, thinking that you solve the anger (or whatever emotion) you feel isn’t! It’s actually making it worse.
Your emotional brain is super primal, and very simplistic. All it wants is to know you took your hand out of the broiling hot shower water, and now your safe, and it’s message worked. It feels the environment and let’s you know if that’s vibing good stuff or danger. Sometime all you gotta do is change environment, or do a couple of jumping jacks, to help that emotional brain know, dangers gone. If you sit in the same spot and stress, your brain can even learn, that’s a stressful spot to sit, every time we sit here, bam, gotta be bad, and spits up those same feelings, even if it’s about nothing, just habit.
It also believes anything you tell it, because it’s listening to vibes. So even if shits fkd, right now, you have to keep telling yourself, everything is OK, you are safe and a capable bad ass, who has handled all the shit life threw so far, so you absolutely got this. Time to shine.
Your emotions are a message for you, and you alone. And if you expect others to sooth your emotions, all the time, you tell yourself that you don’t trust yourself to be capable of helping yourself process emotions. Obviously, we also need connection, so at the same time, it’s not at all about doing it alone. But it’s more about feeling safe to sit in emotions, rather than, fixing them. The way forward is sometimes the way back, sit in the emotion. Don’t try and put it out like it’s a fire, or distract it with shiny things. Just be, and listen, feel. Sometimes you need to sit with someone and not feel like you have to create a false front. Just sit and feel, for a bit.
If
I do feel like unseriousness/unsophisticatedness is generally frowned upon here. Usually things are more debate than conversation
Idk, people just seem a lot more relaxed on like nerdy public discords for example
It’s not a Lemmy thing. People (at least here in the States) are feeling anxious and defeated about the state of the world. That shit makes people irritable. Irritable people are prone to lashing out at anything that trips over their last nerve.
My wife works for a nonprofit that focuses on providing services to families with children who have emotional or intellectual needs. She told me she’s witnessed more meltdowns from parents these last 6 months or so than she’s seen in her 15+ years in the field.
The Americans are getting hostile… And I can’t blame 'em.
Exactly, it’s not just lemmy, and it’s not just the US either.
Essentially it’s late stage capitalism, the root of all our recent discontent in the past 30ish years. Enshittification of everything…
I’d be really curios to see some sort of study done on this. I mean, it’s not just americans and most of the west is not insulated from america, either, at least not online. and you don’t know from talking to someone online where they’re from. At the same time, there’s rising fascism and neoliberalism bullshit in europe, too.
I’d love to know how much of it is people getting antsier in general because they’re in a shit situation and how much it’s ‘infectious’ from talking with people in shit situations elsewhere, spreading bad vibes. Is this also happening in the chinese web? How about other countries that are more politically/economically aligned with the west but culturally less part of the english speaking web?
There has to be some sociologist out there somewhere studying this, no? But i wouldn’t know where to look. if anyone knows of something along those lines, i’d love to hear it.
I don’t like the moderation logs, because they keep the moderators who censor content anonymous. You can’t tell people which moderator is being abusive, so ALL moderators have to be painted as a jackass. That isn’t good, because good moderators have to be a human shield…and the community can’t establish trust.
just general vibe here, even positive news about something happening outside of US and you get a lot of negativity.
Nothing outside the usual to me.
But that’s another good perk of Lemmy: if you don’t like this instance, join another or create your own.
Well im up to 30 user blocks and not long ago someone asked people how many they blocked and it was at about a dozen and 6 of those are alts of one user (same name with different instances). So its closer to go from like 7 to 24. So like in just a few weeks. Maybe over a month or so but not many months I have tripled my blocking of people (I block communities mostly do to it being something I am just not interested at all as opposed to the community is horrible). So take that info as you like.
I think part of it at least is reaching a critical mass.
Lemmy was definitely a collection of relatively like-minded geeks at the start. Even when we disagreed on issues, we all agreed that we needed to work together to make the community grow.
Now that it’s grown to a respectable size, there are more dissenting opinions as well as less tolerance for dissent; and more to the point, there is space for absolutely vile content that used to get choked out. Now to stop this sort of thing, the ‘old-timers’ are more likely to say "shut the fuck up, sit the fuck down, and behave!!!’ before they can get a solid foot hold.
Meanwhile, the worst of those people are feeling both entitled and persecuted, and shouting their garbage louder than ever.
This happens everywhere that gets to a certain size. I remember when reddit stopped feeling like a secret community and more like a warehouse.
Of course, there are other reasons that people have mentioned below: The world is tired, worn out, and PISSED OFF at the half that disagree with them. The president of the United States has broken every rule of diplomacy, grace, and civility that people tended to follow in social life. Social Media has made it far easier (too easy) to dehumanize people and turn them into a one-dimensional pastiche of their posted opinions.
And we’re facing the destruction of the planet, genocide, and the global resurrection of fascism.
The world is getting worse, I’m afraid. I really wish it wasn’t true and I spent a lot of time emphasizing the good to my mom before she died; but honestly, it’s getting worse.
Well said, thank you.
i.e.: Eternal September amplified by the host of knock-on effects stemming from overshoot and the resultant insecurity
I feel like it’s steadily increased over the last 6 months or so, but it’s hard to really say. And it’s still pretty tame.
It seems hostility is the norm across most social media.
Not only is it not more hostile I would argue its less hostile. During the election season you couldn’t say Kamala was anything other than perfect without being called a tankie. Hell you couldn’t even talk about any of the issues that mattered without being called a “single issue voter”. Granted today you have the people saying “well acturally the toxicity is because of those other people”, still not as bad.
Idk, world events got me raging nonstop and I’m sure I’m not the only one. But I’m trying to reset.
Reset by like… Burning everything?
Excuse me?! Are you saying I’m negative?! Are you trying to start a fight with me, bro?! I am THE, I mean THE most positive, fun and likeable person on THE internet, bro. THE.
While Lemmy might be getting a larger variety of personalities, some of them being jerks, I still find it a far more pleasant place to be than reddit.
Yea the shitposting has steadily increased. That is probably to be expected on a platform that is also steadily increasing.
However please don’t let the trolls think they turn this into the failure that is now Reddit.
Instead just call out the bullshit for what it is and carry on.
It’s growing everywhere. The problem is subjective, which is why the current model fails. I’ve tried to suggest ones in the past where users have more control about general moderation in their communities or can at least choose their curators, with communities themselves are more decentralized from their instances, but there is no interest, at least not in losing that power of control.
The people who downvote after every reply don’t really help, they either just want the last word or aren’t really interested in an honest conversation. The anonymous downvotes don’t really help either (specially when they coincide with thread upvotes coming from accounts with no comment or post history that just seem interested in nudging the conversation to an alt).
There’s a facet of internet culture that revolves around ridicule. I’m not sure but I think it stems from the streamer world. It’s like a modern form of celebrity gossip (read: harassment) that got commoditized into social media. So it’s not just gossiping about celebrities like in the past era of media.
Harassment used to be driven by publishers. In this era of social media anyone and everyone is a content publisher. People trawl the internet for things they think can be made spectacle. Right down to a random internet comment 100 replies deep in a thread. If for whatever reason they think this person is to be made a fool of then they proceed to reply with such belligerence.
They engage as if they are an outside observer. As if they’ve an audience like it’s Jerry Springer or something. As if they are the only human being. They don’t see others as human. Everyone else are caged animals for them taunt. To throw objects at through the cage bars or to tap on the glass. They think they are the main character.
I think there’s some psychological effect where their parasocial relationship with their favorite streamers and the herd of loyal viewers gives them a false sense of power based on the crowd effect or something. They can’t see it from the perspective that they are a lone poster being deranged.
I think the vote/like/share model gives them a false sense of power. When they see the uplikes number go up, they think they have a herd of supporters behind them. A simple little number on a screen emboldens them.
Nobody seems to see anything out of the ordinary with this. Such is the nature of this era of internet and the hostility. It’s normalized. They don’t know of any way of being.
You’re not a streamer with a herd of followers. You’re just a sole internet user. You have no crowd behind you. It’s like you think you do. It’s bizarre. From observers outside your perspective, you’re like an unstable person wandering the city streets. Pedestrians avoid you. They don’t want to aggravate you. You’re seen as someone possibly having a mental break. Or is it drugs or some kind of substance abuse.
On the internet now it’s unavoidable. These crazies are out here. They’re aggravated. They jump down anyones throat. On much of social media it’s the only way they know how to be. Just belligerence against belligerence all the time. Nobody talks like a normal human being. It’s like they’re derealized. Dissociated.
A basic fact that internet has no moderators anymore. They’re moderators in name only. The definition of the word is lost. To “moderate”. To preside over a discussion. Nobody does this anymore. The crazies are allowed to run amok. There’s some hints of actual moderation on Lemmy instances. The extremists have been grinding away at wearing this down though. In general this kind of thing is completely absent on social media anymore.
The only time I see it anymore comes from people from the older eras of internet. Those to came about in the modern internet have no concept of civility.
Get a load of this guy
A lot of it came from early 4chan and the online culture war of creationism. It’s like the right test drove its tactics using creationism, and also took what they saw was popular with the cool internet kids.
Good post and you see exactly what ive seen as well. Something is very wrong with online people today. They dont realize they are wrong. I guess its hard to see when they get upvoted for being wrong.
I find it quite bizarre that people came here after a single reddit app stopped working. My favorite reddit apps still work lol
Edit: I love the downvotes on a post about an uptick in hostility
It wasn’t because of the apps.
It was because closing down the APIs - despite the widespread protests and subreddit blackouts - was the final nail in the coffin for many. It proved reddit was no longer a place where community opinion mattered at all, or had any sway in how the site might operate.
It was proof that things were firmly entering the enshittification phase of milking the reddit userbase and their content for profit, pushing a first-party app full of ads, and fattening up the balance sheet for investors.
I left at that time because I didn’t want to subject myself to that, and no number of “still working” apps would change my opinion.
If not because of the apps, then why do they mention the app shutting down specifically instead of the API changes?
Never used the app. I’m here cause after an effort gain enough karma to post in the group I joined reddit for, I found I had been shadowbanned (had to look up what it was) and had been from the creation of the account. Never spammed, no trash, no fights. In fact I still have 1 karma. Found out days ago I was shadowbanned (cause some mod finally took pity on my posts trying to understand how to get karma, which I couldn’t cause no one saw anything I posted, ever) and realized that all that effort was worthless because of some AI or other that flagged me for some unknown reason and they didn’t have the (insert word here) to indicate there was any issue. Not interested in the ban hammer that drops off the shelf and happens to hit you. Sad thing really as I tracked the group through another means and it’s been great. reddit can eat my karma. and their shadowban hammer.
I’ve had a private message from a user who’s a starting with ‘v and ending with n’ and that’s all I say because if I say the full word I know some angry Internet people are going to show up
They responded with that passive aggressive question tone
I’ve also run into some lemmy users that spread misinformation about Japan to discredit it which reads like foreign actors intentionally spreading disinformation to discredit a country and its people, the sake kind of misinformation about Japan is much worser on reddit but its not a good thing that it has started to show up here
There is a lot of psy-ops going on, with bots trying to promote certain ideas as popular, to influence perception.
Facism is making the people that would normally be reasonable get really emotional and people love to lash out anonymously.
The world is kind of a shitty place right now. And to be honest, I’d be surprised if it wasn’t, at least to some degree, affecting everyone’s calm.
Its always been shitty. Ask your grandparents how they felt growing up during wars and poverty.
Every new generation is surprised the world is kind of shitty. And today you have massive psy-ops ongoing to make people fight eachother all the time.
I first joined and started using Lemmy probably a couple months before you.
Back then, when anyone was being uncivil, needlessly hostile, rude, or aggressive, there was a very high likelihood that other users would call it out quickly. Many, many wonderful folks did it on my behalf multiple times and that’s one of the big reasons I stuck around, because that’s cool as hell if you ask me. I’m here to enjoy myself and have a little fun, not to be verbally abused because some problematic person lacks reading comprehension or prefers to make wild assumptions based on very limited information.
I won’t say there’s been a recent uptick in hostility, unless your definition of lately is a lot more lenient than my own. However, I will say that with each new outrage from Reddit comes an influx of new users and with each new influx, it’s only a short period of time before I notice things are suddenly a bit less nice, friendly, and casual.
Sadly, things are at the point now where I rarely bother to read any responses, replies, or messages in my inbox. I usually just go in there to click “mark as read” to clear the notifications without reading them and move on. There’s just too much negativity directed my way, often super randomly to the most innocuous stuff, or random users I can’t recall ever interacting with who somehow seem to have a chip on their shoulder. It’s actually kind of bizarre at times. Regardless, for my style of participation, which is mostly parodying old people facebook and sharing random anecdotes, feeling like I need to ignore replies is still okay, I guess.
Anyway, glad I’m not the only one who has noticed the shift. Wish there were an easy button to get things back to the welcoming place Lemmy used to be.
I am here from only some weeks but i noticed that in the last days i got waay more hate than normal and i noticed that in many convos people are starting to ““abuse”” upvotes and downvotes by downvoting everthing a dude say even if they are asking sorry, stating something right or is unrelated like how it was on reddit
It was more welcoming but also almost no keyboard warriors. First few months were quite nice here.
It takes a special kind of person to be a good moderator.
When it comes to social media, that’s an oxymoron.
That’s just not true.
A good moderator on a platform like lemmy removes content that breaks the rules, and ban users who are unwilling to learn or improve.
Sure, they would do that, if good moderators were a thing that could exist. Which they most evidently aren’t, as demonstrated by every single example to have ever cursed the world with their existence.
What we get instead are the same old powermods from reddit, arbitrarily ruling as unelected tyrants over dozens of unrelated communities, often across multiple instances, banning users across all of them for misinterpreted comments (can’t seemingly be a moderator without having skin as thin as rice paper, and without lacking any semblance of reading comprehension) or for not agreeing with their own personal lunacies. And the worst of them are admins to boot, or even the developers themselves.
Anyone who wants to be a moderator will inevitably lack any ability to be one, and will almost certainly be acting in bad faith, if not at first then the second they’ve had a taste of their power over their petty little kingdom, and should immediately be permabanned from all instances for the safety of the users.
But obviously we can’t force anyone who doesn’t want to be one to take the position, lest they end up becoming even worse out of spite.
The point of being able to upvote and downvote, and block if necessary, is to make moderators unnecessary (not that they don’t do a good job of that themselves, of course, but this removes any possible excuse that they might be a necessary evil). That’s the lesson we should have learned from reddit: moderators are unnecessary, obsolete, and extremely harmful; they will ruin any social network they infest, and if they’re admins on top of that they’ll be several orders of magnitude worse, and enshittify the platform as much as possible.
At least here we can block their communities and instances infested by the worst of them, I suppose, cut away the worst of the cancer, but that just makes this a least worst situation, not a good or even tolerable one.
As the space becomes more popular, the level of social cohesion goes down.
Also, every space on the internet where users talk is now infested with shit chatbots trying to keep poor people angry with each other to prevent us from flaying rich people alive
Does it actually get more popular? I see Lemmy, Piefed and Mbin together at around 40k monthly active users. It hasn’t really gained a lot of new active users, the peak was 50k monthly active users a while ago, so it seems to get less popular.
It’s been slowly but steadily increasing
Woah woah woah. None of us said flaying ALIVE! It’ll ruin the flavor of the meat!
Sadly, this is the internet :(
Sir, this is a Wendys.
Isn’t it just people? Why did Rome fall? They had better tech, more people etc. I think they fell because the glue that held the society together dissolved. They had enough success that the human impulses that tear things apart were no longer suppressed. Lets kill people for sport, someone else should deal with the invaders, etc. A big part of that glue is apparent need. That guy in my way is the blacksmith that I need or I don’t know that guy get the F out of my way. Our major challenge has shifted from trying to survive to competition with other people.
I think this is where a lot of the hostility comes from. Now add in another force, marketing and business. It’s not like they are really worried about your well-being. They prey on these things like a con artist preys on trust. Feed the easy things that everyone wants. A kid is going to choose the candy bar over the brussels sprouts most times. You deserve a break today, you deserve everything. Feed this and you end up with a lot of believers. I deserve everything and those people are preventing it. Plug in a system (AI) that only purpose is to get more of your attention and what will it feed you? Trolling, anger, hate are all easy. The feelings from them are strong, addicting even. They feel powerful. Stir well and spread widely. Pretty simple recipe.
For the final topping, the people who rule us. Yah rule us. Do good people chase power in this environment? Can a good person stop the mob of 50 people that are gonna do some damage? At what point to people start giving up resisting those impulses and joining the mob. I want to do some damage too. As we see our leaders and the things they do, our examples, the people we trusted to do the right thing, the people who get the make the rules, who are so removed from the people they rule as I am from that ant I just stepped on. As this snowball gets bigger and faster it’s harder and harder to stop. Rolls over most things except that cliff where it will go splat. Everyone feels it. It’s hard to miss if you look. Any attempt to stop it creates a conflict between the stoppers and those that are fine in that snow ball and the people that are actively pushing that snowball. It will eventually stop and most times it’s a very messy stop.
Why hasn’t there been a successful civilization that has lasted, people and who are people… ?
Many paragraphs were left feeling unused in that comment.
huh… that’s odd they didn’t come through. Does shift-enter not work? When I edit it I still see the shift-enter. Just added enter.
Now I see them!
From a neutral viewpoint, the world is more divided than ever, no matter what values you have, there’s someone who opposes them with few, if any exceptions. Those opposing viewpoints have only grown in strength and number on the Internet, for years.
Additionally, the “us vs them” mentality of everyone is blinding them to even understanding why someone would disagree with their viewpoint. Of course that’s not everyone, but it’s a growing and very loud group.
Political violence is also starting to run rampant. Escalation after escalation. It keeps building.
So in this time of having a global voice, that can reach hundreds of millions of people with a single tweet or comment or thread or post or whatever, and with so much growing hatred among different political groups, it’s unsurprising to me that conflict is rising.
Additionally, Lemmy is growing. Not everyone that joins Lemmy will be the same type of person that joined Lemmy after the Reddit API incident. That influx of people had a very similar value set, because they almost all came here from Reddit for the same reason. So there’s at least a good amount of overlap in everyone’s values.
Over time, more and more diverse people have been joining Lemmy, and it’s not surprising that they have differing opinions on a lot of things.
This outcome was pretty much inevitable.
As far as I’m concerned, as long as it’s done respectfully and civilly, then disagree. Debate. Try to understand the opposing viewpoint, even if you don’t agree with it.
Fuck off /s
That’s exactly the same time I migrated. Personally, no, I haven’t noticed an uptick in that, it’s just as hostile as ever. It just about scratches the itch enough to be a functional replacement for what Reddit used to be for me though so I hang around. There’s solace in that it’s not ALL nasty, it’s just extremely likely to devolve in to that at a hair trigger and however benign or even how mundane the original topic of discussion, someone will try to clumsily make it related fascism or imperialism.